Bad Front End Bounce

[Tim_C.]

I bought the car from silkdagger in Salt Lake. I just need to get it home to Colorado, but it shimmys very very badly at 25 mph if I'm just cruising. I can get it going faster if I stay accellerating smoothly to 40 or so before it does it, but then it is even more violent.

 

The struts are bad, but that shouldn't make it shimmy so badly. The gear box has tons of play in it and someone pulled the power steering unit, but still, that shouldn't cause the front end to feel like its going to fall off.

 

I talked with some mechanic friends of mine and they think it is maybe a tire that sat flat for a while and has cord damage. I'm going to take it in to a tire shop to get new front tires put on and see if they can inspect it for me. I just need to get it home, but it is a 6 hour drive.

 

sildagger took me around the block and I knew it was like this before I bought it, so no fault is being placed on him. I bought it as is. I just didn't realize it was this bad LoL!

 

Any thoughts are appreciated. I'm staying in a hotel tonight for sure, and maybe longer!

[Chad]

I had a car with a bad front strut, it shimmied real bad too, but only over 50, and only after a bump or dip would cause it to osscilate. When I tore it out and removed the spring, the whole strut piston just 'fell' into the housing (it was that bad). Mine had good tires, a bad tire woudl make that worse. Try swapping the fronts letf to right and vise-versa.

[strang3majik]

broken sway bar linkage? Does the wheel have play in it when jacked up, as in, up and down, or side to side?

 

For it to vibrate badly at low speeds, it has to be something a little bigger than a tire out of balance or with flat spots...I would think.

Edited March 21, 2009 by strang3majik

[Caliber308]

broken sway bar linkage? Does the wheel have play in it when jacked up, as in, up and down, or side to side?

 

For it to vibrate badly at low speeds, it has to be something a little bigger than a tire out of balance or with flat spots...I would think.

 

Sounds about right. I had almost the same feeling on a 1988 Pathfinder, both sway bar mounts were broke off.

 

CALIBER 308

 

[Sully]

Broken belt in tires

bent wheel

 

THats about all unless there are other symptoms

 

broken sway bar linkage? Does the wheel have play in it when jacked up, as in, up and down, or side to side?

 

For it to vibrate badly at low speeds, it has to be something a little bigger than a tire out of balance or with flat spots...I would think.

no way can a sway bar link cause a vibration. a sway bar is only used in turns and does absolutely NOTHING in a straight line. There would probably be a hell of a rattle over bumps from the bar wacking everything and handle like a wet noodle but thats about it.

Edited March 21, 2009 by Sully

[michael knight]

^What he said.

[strang3majik]

Broken belt in tires

bent wheel

 

THats about all unless there are other symptoms

 

 

no way can a sway bar link cause a vibration. a sway bar is only used in turns and does absolutely NOTHING in a straight line. There would probably be a hell of a rattle over bumps from the bar wacking everything and handle like a wet noodle but thats about it.

 

Id still check it out. Had one break on a Mustang....vibrated like a mother...turned out, thats what it was.

Edited March 21, 2009 by strang3majik

[Technology]

There are ball joints too. Just grab the tire with your hands and jerk it around to see where the play is. This is why the term "tire kicker" was invented. People trying to see if anything was broken.

[Tim_C.]

Thanks guys. It's still dark outside so I am waiting for some light to go out and check it out.

[Tim_C.]

After looking at it this morning, and adding up a few other issues with the car, I decided to try and rent a car dolly and truck, and haul it back on it.

1. Front struts are total junk. I think they are exactly what Chad described.

2. 8" of play in the steering wheel. I drove my red car for a few years with 4" of play, and it was scary. This thing is not drivable for that reason alone.

3. There was no brake fluid in the reservoir at all. We filled it, but they need bled before I can drive it. No problem really, just more time preventing me from getting out of here, and I may find issues with them, so it's best to not mess with it. What is odd is he had a receipt that says 'brake light always on'. I wonder why that was, and what mechanic would write that without checking the reservoir. Or, he did check and filled it, and the light stayed on for other reasons and it went dry after! Both of which means I shouldn't drive it. Hopefully I can dolly it.

4. No E-Brake. He said the e-brake cable was removed from passenger side due to locking up the caliper, so he replaced the caliper but didn't put the cable back on for whatever reason. I suspect issues with it, or he just couldn't get it on there.

5. There was no coolant showing in the radiator, but it only took about 3/4 of a gallon to fill. Long story there too, but I don't want to get out on the road to find out why that was.

6. Rear tires are bald.

7. Fans don't work. I can wire them to work, but I'll probably just leave it for the tow home.

 

There's more, but I just made reservations to pick up the truck and dolly for $300 one way from Salt Lake to Montrose CO. I better get movin'!

[Technology]

lol. You bought a fixer upper.

 

From the sounds of it, yes the dolly was the right choice. If you have tools with you, you should disconnect the driveshaft so you don't rack up the miles just being towed! haha.

[Komeuppance]

Dayum... sounds like that car needs some TLC. $300 bones ain't bad at all for a dolly and a truck.

 

-Robert

[Tim_C.]

I made it home with the car! 350 miles took 5 1/2 hours with the u-haul truck and dolly. With insurance it was over $400 plus gas.

The clutch pedal has a very bad feel too. Like the fork will sanp in half the next time you push it in! I didn't want to chance that either.

The oil is black black, which actually was a relief to see!

The car started to die at intersections before I got it limped to the U-Haul place.

[Caliber308]

Broken belt in tires

bent wheel

 

THats about all unless there are other symptoms

 

 

no way can a sway bar link cause a vibration. a sway bar is only used in turns and does absolutely NOTHING in a straight line. There would probably be a hell of a rattle over bumps from the bar wacking everything and handle like a wet noodle but thats about it.

 

Maybe I just imagined it was vibrating LIKE HELL from the broken Sway bar mounts. But what do I know??? Well. it wasn't a "broken belt or bent rim". So we were both WRONG!!!! I'll admit it...Will you ???? Sully, Check this out: Starion FSM Volume 1. Page 26 Master Troubleshooting, Steering Wheel Shimmy. READ IT!!! You said in response to strang3majik post: "No way a sway bar link can cause a vibration"?? Like I said, Read page 26. You might learn something.

 

CALIBER 308

Edited March 22, 2009 by Caliber308

[Sully]

ha.... after the last one we picked up we said that we would always tow any others regardless of the condition of the vehicle. Cheaper and less frustrating that way.

[juice_2]

my lower control arms and radius rods were loose caused it to shimmy from about the same speed.

[Tim_C.]

ha.... after the last one we picked up we said that we would always tow any others regardless of the condition of the vehicle. Cheaper and less frustrating that way.

 

Yeah, that's a good policy!

 

One front rim is bent that I can see just by looking at it. Couple that with the trashed struts and it could be what was causing to majority of it.

[silkdagger05]

I did call you and tell you not to buy it after i found out the tie rods were not to blame for the shimmy. ...

BTW you never called dave or me back to replace the struts and tires..? did you make it home ok? did you still need a bed and truck to tow it ? dave might still be available.

 

edit , just finished reading page. might be the distributor advanced is still off a little bit ?

Edited March 23, 2009 by silkdagger05

[Wolf87Conquest]

Sure sounds like you got quite the fixer upper!

Another thing that will cause front end vibrations....wheel bearings. Loose castle nut or worn out. Since you already know it has bad struts, loose steering box and so on...won't hurt any to check the wheel bearings.

Good luck with it.

 

[Tim_C.]

I did call you and tell you not to buy it after i found out the tie rods were not to blame for the shimmy. ...

BTW you never called dave or me back to replace the struts and tires..? did you make it home ok? did you still need a bed and truck to tow it ? dave might still be available.

 

edit , just finished reading page. might be the distributor advanced is still off a little bit ?

 

The way you advertised it didn't match what it was. Not even close, but I gave you the money and took it, so it's all on me. You needed to start the ad by saying the car is not drivable. I couldn't even get it down a city street, let alone the highway without the violent bouncing. Then you could follow up with ads like, "swapped the tie rods and didn't fix it". I guess my point is if it isn't drivable don't say it is your daily driver as you did in page 2 of your thread. The car had 132,576 miles on it when I picked it up on March 20th. Your pick on Feb 4th had 132,564. So that is 12 miles in 5 weeks. I know you couldn't have driven far in 6 months, and you even said when I picked it up that it sat since November. A bit contradictive to what you posted in your thread.

When you called you had so many stories about this and that, and how you really wanted to keep the car for your "backup" plan if the Cougar didn't work out etc... I wasn't about to believe much of what you said then because I knew you really wanted to keep the car. Besides, that was a moot point then since I already made flight arrangements to pick it up after we made the agreement. I had no idea it had a violent bad pounding of the front spindles before, until you drove it and it did the bambambambambambambambambambambambam thing when you let of the gas.

You also didn't list it had no power steering pump. You told me that with the rest of your stories after the agreement. You never did tell me about the major, major play in the steering wheel either. Do you know that can kill someone? You are lucky I took it off your hands because that amount of play with no power assist, will rip the steering coupler rubber in no time flat and it will give out on the hardest turn when you need it the most. Definitely something I would mention in an ad for it, or at least bring it up at some point before an agreement is made.

 

2 tires were going flat before I even got it home! Sitting flatter than flat on the bent rims now, 2 days later! LoL!

I definitely would've advertised that car a lot differently, but then money is not my priority in life, so it doesn't rule my decisions. And I'm not rich either. I make an hourly wage in the blue collar world.

 

I actually have all the parts that I know are bad on it, as spares laying around, so I might try to fix it, but it will take a lot of work. I think I would rather use it for parts because I won't ever get that much out of it even after fixing it.

 

I did talk to Dave that night and told him not to worry about the strut assemblies he volunteered to give me. I wasn't about to take a POS like that on the road.

[Caliber308]

The way you advertised it didn't match what it was. Not even close, but I gave you the money and took it, so it's all on me. You needed to start the ad by saying the car is not drivable. I couldn't even get it down a city street, let alone the highway without the violent bouncing. Then you could follow up with ads like, "swapped the tie rods and didn't fix it". I guess my point is if it isn't drivable don't say it is your daily driver as you did in page 2 of your thread. The car had 132,576 miles on it when I picked it up on March 20th. Your pick on Feb 4th had 132,564. So that is 12 miles in 5 weeks. I know you couldn't have driven far in 6 months, and you even said when I picked it up that it sat since November. A bit contradictive to what you posted in your thread.

When you called you had so many stories about this and that, and how you really wanted to keep the car for your "backup" plan if the Cougar didn't work out etc... I wasn't about to believe much of what you said then because I knew you really wanted to keep the car. Besides, that was a moot point then since I already made flight arrangements to pick it up after we made the agreement. I had no idea it had a violent bad pounding of the front spindles before, until you drove it and it did the bambambambambambambambambambambambam thing when you let of the gas.

You also didn't list it had no power steering pump. You told me that with the rest of your stories after the agreement. You never did tell me about the major, major play in the steering wheel either. Do you know that can kill someone? You are lucky I took it off your hands because that amount of play with no power assist, will rip the steering coupler rubber in no time flat and it will give out on the hardest turn when you need it the most. Definitely something I would mention in an ad for it, or at least bring it up at some point before an agreement is made.

 

2 tires were going flat before I even got it home! Sitting flatter than flat on the bent rims now, 2 days later! LoL!

I definitely would've advertised that car a lot differently, but then money is not my priority in life, so it doesn't rule my decisions. And I'm not rich either. I make an hourly wage in the blue collar world.

 

I actually have all the parts that I know are bad on it, as spares laying around, so I might try to fix it, but it will take a lot of work. I think I would rather use it for parts because I won't ever get that much out of it even after fixing it.

 

I did talk to Dave that night and told him not to worry about the strut assemblies he volunteered to give me. I wasn't about to take a POS like that on the road.

 

Tim, I hope you didn't pay over $100.00 for it.. :hmm3grin2orange:

 

CALIBER 308

 

[Tim_C.]

The for sale thread is in the cars for sale forum. I locked it so it stays the same.

The engine picture shows the power steering reservoir with no mention that it isn't hooked to a pump! A bit misleading for sure.

One thing I've always known and this reconfirmed it. There are two sure signs someone isn't being open and honest:

1. They must tell you multiple times how "brutally honest" they are.

2. They talk so much you know that you know they just love to hear themselves.

 

Yes, I'm the dumb one, but I could part it out and make 90% back, so it's not all bad. What I'll probably do instead is keep it and use the few good parts on my others. I'll park it and scavenge from it if I have to. After flying to Salt Lake to pick it up, I decided to go through with it and take something home to show for my effort.

[Prevolution]

Seems the only thing the previous owner disclosed in the ad :

 

"could use third syncro. and some rear speakers."

 

I wonder if he'll offer to pay for the tow ?

 

Do you mind mentioning what you paid for it ?

 

 

 

 

[silkdagger05]

The way you advertised it didn't match what it was. Not even close, but I gave you the money and took it, so it's all on me. You needed to start the ad by saying the car is not drivable. I couldn't even get it down a city street, let alone the highway without the violent bouncing. Then you could follow up with ads like, "swapped the tie rods and didn't fix it". I guess my point is if it isn't drivable don't say it is your daily driver as you did in page 2 of your thread. The car had 132,576 miles on it when I picked it up on March 20th. Your pick on Feb 4th had 132,564. So that is 12 miles in 5 weeks. I know you couldn't have driven far in 6 months, and you even said when I picked it up that it sat since November. A bit contradictive to what you posted in your thread.

When you called you had so many stories about this and that, and how you really wanted to keep the car for your "backup" plan if the Cougar didn't work out etc... I wasn't about to believe much of what you said then because I knew you really wanted to keep the car. Besides, that was a moot point then since I already made flight arrangements to pick it up after we made the agreement. I had no idea it had a violent bad pounding of the front spindles before, until you drove it and it did the bambambambambambambambambambambambam thing when you let of the gas.

You also didn't list it had no power steering pump. You told me that with the rest of your stories after the agreement. You never did tell me about the major, major play in the steering wheel either. Do you know that can kill someone? You are lucky I took it off your hands because that amount of play with no power assist, will rip the steering coupler rubber in no time flat and it will give out on the hardest turn when you need it the most. Definitely something I would mention in an ad for it, or at least bring it up at some point before an agreement is made.

 

2 tires were going flat before I even got it home! Sitting flatter than flat on the bent rims now, 2 days later! LoL!

I definitely would've advertised that car a lot differently, but then money is not my priority in life, so it doesn't rule my decisions. And I'm not rich either. I make an hourly wage in the blue collar world.

 

I actually have all the parts that I know are bad on it, as spares laying around, so I might try to fix it, but it will take a lot of work. I think I would rather use it for parts because I won't ever get that much out of it even after fixing it.

 

I did talk to Dave that night and told him not to worry about the strut assemblies he volunteered to give me. I wasn't about to take a POS like that on the road.

 

I told you when you contacted me about it that it need the tie rods replaced to fix the "bounce" "shimmy" "vibration" per a mechanic. i got them done finally a week before you were supose to be here. and found out they were wrong, upon finding out I called you no less than 30 minutes later telling you i didnt think it was drivable. and my exact words were not to buy it yet that i would give you first dibs. I didnt know the struts were bad. and i didnt pressure you into buying it either. I said we could give you a ride back to the hotel what would you like to do. you just kept saying no i can get it home. and after you bought it I still offered to get it tires, and dave-o and I both offered to tow it home for you and replace the struts. you turned both of us down. I only knew about the third synco and speakers. plus the fan wires which i didnt hide either.

I am sorry it was not the way I posted it but i didnt know how bad it was untill I called you. and I was honest about what I knew. and I am glad you got home ok.

Edited March 24, 2009 by silkdagger05

[Dcrasta]

Now Now no sour grapes. A fair exchange is not a robbery. Tim is knowledgeable enough about these cars not to be robbed. That seller probably didnt have the mechanical knowledge to accurately say all the problems. Besides, what is it in latin? 'Caveat emptor"

 

 

 

BTW I would check the lower control arm bushings sounds like what my car did to me (my passenger side was worn from the beatings from driving in the city)