Siance Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 Good point...... :)I agree all starquest owners lookin to go huge on power MPI is the best way to go... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shift1313 Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 well ive worked/working out a few designs for my own. im building other things now but in a few months i will have a flow bench to work on so im going to flow stock intake vs a few of my designs to see what works best. I can pretty much guarantee if you run stand alone on your tbi and get rid of your mas you will see big gains. The insde of the cast on the stock manifold has rough walls for turbulance to help mix the air/fuel. not really what you want for mpi(to that extent). You will see gains on any intake that has a symetric and reasonable design, the question is the most for your money. I dont want to buy an intake no matter how cool it looks if there is no theory behind it, but rather something made to fit. Now if this guy designs FI cars that doesnt mean hes got the knowledge to design an intake(not saying he does or doesnt) for a low revving big bore 4cyl. I would definately like to see some ideas put forth from this and see where this goes. remember you need to put out proof of concept or some flow numbers or something to go by Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eeaston Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 I can prolly count on my hands the guys that are running mpi...all the other starquest owners are TBI. http://www.starquestclub.com/index.pl?boar...89226456;start= You must be some kinda freak, what with your 31+ fingers ;D Wet manifolds are just flat less efficient than dry. There is no way around that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siance Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 I have 50 fingers .... .... Well see what he comes up with...But we all agree the manifold has to be a good price, and proven.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smog Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 I:m with art on a short runner intake. Throw a 282/284 cam on your engine and you now have a much higher revving engine than the stock 5k and there aint no more cam. 6500 to 7000rpm engine is a fairly high reving design. Like arty said witht he supra intakes. The newest hks intake design has super short runners, and rounded plenium, and they were only taking it to 8k. The car is making over 1000hp might I add. Unless you are going to stick with a stock cam after mpi "why I don't know.." I think a short runner intake would be better. Throw a large turbo on the car, and thats also going to increase your high end. I tihkn most of us are striving for more rpms. Torque is great, but whats the use of a car that only has power for 2k rpms? I'd like to have a nice powerband between 3000-7000, might be wishfull thinking.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcrasta Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 YEah smog PREACH BROTHA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shift1313 Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 if i was at the strip maybe. but for a street car give me torque anyday. thats what makes it fun to drive light to light:) If you are running a big turbo and high boost then your runner length makes little difference in the long run. Its off boost and getting spool up where that torque comes in handy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siance Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 I would like to have a power band of 1500 to 6000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smog Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 Well if you need more torque than is already producing for our engines cool. I would just look at some of the dyno cahrts of people making a lousy 210hp and 278ish ft lbs of torque. It sure would be nice to see those numbers matching each other. Then again im not building the intake. Just my clueless opinion I'd say look at some other performance intakes ut there and go from there. Supras being a good choice imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALANFROMPDX Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 Quality is the Key, If it looks good it will sell. Everyone is going supersized turbo's so the long runner theory is really useless. Long runner is all I get from the calculators but short runner is all I see in turbo and modified mag so theory is just that i guess. But it has to look good. A great design is stupid when the welds look like they were put on with a putty knife. If it looks stellar but flows ok I will just get a bigger turbo -pdx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smog Posted September 25, 2004 Report Share Posted September 25, 2004 Alan is probably right, as long as it doesnt look like it was jb welded it will probably sell as long as its sexy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcrasta Posted September 26, 2004 Report Share Posted September 26, 2004 Quality is the Key, If it looks good it will sell. Everyone is going supersized turbo's so the long runner theory is really useless. Long runner is all I get from the calculators but short runner is all I see in turbo and modified mag so theory is just that i guess. But it has to look good. A great design is stupid when the welds look like they were put on with a putty knife. If it looks stellar but flows ok I will just get a bigger turbo -pdx Agreed.. I think the magazine turbo manifolds are all for 4valve per cylinder cars also. I would think they would need less length because of the better flow of the 4valve heads. But I would prefer a compromise that allows us to keep a torque bias but make high hp.. Yeah I would buy one if it was sexy. (but that Magna is sexy mang! Bling!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerastan Posted September 27, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 27, 2004 well, i can tell you all...... sexy is what this thing will be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan_V Posted September 27, 2004 Report Share Posted September 27, 2004 Just an idea, but thinking about cars with similar engine configurations Ford 2.3 turbo Toyota 3.0 turbo Nissan twin turbo And the closest match in liter displacement?! Nissan RB26DETT and RB25DET Â Can we see what these intakes are designed around then copy?? The skyline uses short 4-6 inch runners Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yokomo Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 and is a 6 cyl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siance Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Why not make a intake with both options mpi or TBI, that way everyone can get on to it!! Is that possible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metric-man Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 http://tinypic.com/c6x02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metric-man Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 Whoa this thread is great where have I been...? War of TBI vs MPI.....? MPI makes the most sense if you going to go big you might as well go all the way I don't think it necessarily needs to have long runners because the injectors are mounted directly into the cylinders and the plenum acts as part of the runner... It is not so much the four valve design uses more air as it is the design of air flow.. you can get as much flow as with two valves they just have to be large enough.. It is the angle of air flow and the smoothness of the transsisions..like music.. harmonics play a big role... How about a Cosworth design And over in the left corner... We have the TBI which cost effective it isn't because two of our injectors costs just as / or more than four injectors... but some of us live in California and with a carbon fiber TBI it would pass the State B.S. as long as it retained a EGR passage blah blah blah... I like the idea of the Thermostat housing in C.F. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metric-man Posted October 12, 2004 Report Share Posted October 12, 2004 http://tinypic.com/c6x5y Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zer0fist Posted October 13, 2004 Report Share Posted October 13, 2004 Hay Jerastan, I had a design I was working on, Â but its half finished. Â I got married and it seams like I have no time anymore to tinker (except for my DSM anyway) Its a G54B TBI Â using a 65mm Ford TB (out of a Crown Vic) and 2 additional 440cc injectors (2gen DSM green) held in place with Greddy AIC bungs. Â The EGR is shaved off and welded up, Â and the runners/pre-runners are ported the plan was to run a tweeked 86 ecu and Rebic AIC, Â but now i'm really loving the Fuel Injection Pro setup, Â so I was going to run that with my Rebic 3 I have the manifold but, Â the section with the Ford TB is not complete. Â I can e-mail you pics of the hardware i have and my drawings of the project to fwd you to. I like muiltiport injection but i wanted to take the TBI to its limit, Â call me crazy but i believe in the TBIs simplicity. Â It just needs to be augmented. You can email me at zerofist@hotmail.com Also I'll try to get this info to you before Friday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatBirch Posted October 15, 2004 Report Share Posted October 15, 2004 Let me just add this to the mix- While my montero is not only turbo, but MPI as well, there are tons of montero and D-50 owners that would love another option. With a longer runner, they would benefit from it as well leading to more sales. The Magna came off a N/A car. I know that adding that intake to a stock Montero with a new management system would be a HUGE improvement over the stock carb setup. It would make it cheaper and easier than swapping in the whole turbo setup. It's all about selling enough to make it worthwhile. My wife works in the art world. I took some time to look into the art of "Lost Wax Casting" It is pretty affordable once you have a model to work from, and the foam would be a great place to start. Sculptors usually use this medium to work in bronze, but aluminum would be just as easy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest c89zx7r Posted October 17, 2004 Report Share Posted October 17, 2004 someone needs to make a kit to take out the jetvalves and put injectors in there place , then who cares what kind of intake it is . i say go TBI Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustPaus_88TSi Posted October 22, 2004 Report Share Posted October 22, 2004 Oh yeah.. Now that's an idea! And put the spark plugs right across from that...Wait? Impossible? CNC CF'd head? haha It'd be cool though.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerastan Posted October 27, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2004 yeah, i'm thinking that'd be inexpensive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
‰ Posted October 27, 2004 Report Share Posted October 27, 2004 someone needs to make a kit to take out the jetvalves and put injectors in there place , then who cares what kind of intake it is . i say go TBI You may want to repaint your hood with hi-temp enamel exhaust paint, and.... add an automatic marshmallow dispenser while you're at it! ;D ;D Just jokin.... neat idea though! I've been following this post, but somehow I can't figure out where we are on completion of this idea..... help? :-/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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