Too Deep Posted June 13, 2004 Report Share Posted June 13, 2004 1 thing i didnt think about 4l60 = removable bellhousing+ electronic shift+pwm pressure contol solenoid 700r4 = nonremovable bellhousing + shifts without electronics(govenor/tv cable) differnt case ??? ive never heard of a 4l60 shifting witout electronics push button up-down shifts r possible with max line pressure(race only)but full auto without gm pcm would be tough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89onaquest Posted June 13, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2004 1 thing i didnt think about 4l60 = removable bellhousing+ electronic shift+pwm pressure contol solenoid 700r4 = nonremovable bellhousing + shifts without electronics(govenor/tv cable) differnt case ??? ive never heard of a 4l60 shifting witout electronics push button up-down shifts r possible with max line pressure(race only)but full auto without gm pcm would be tough Ahh but the beauty is that people can build a relay box that acts as a ECM. Don't ask ME how to do it, but hell look at the megasquirt gang. Just need something to provide V out at certain points. Dunno... but I know it could be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie_Rich Posted June 13, 2004 Report Share Posted June 13, 2004 I'm by no means an expert on these trannies, but that link I provided above calls it a 4l60. Looking a little further, I found that the removable bellhousings came around '96. See this link for more info http://www.novak-adapt.com/knowledge/4l60e.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Too Deep Posted June 14, 2004 Report Share Posted June 14, 2004 Ahh but the beauty is that people can build a relay box that acts as a ECM. Don't ask ME how to do it, but hell look at the megasquirt gang. Just need something to provide V out at certain points. Dunno... but I know it could be done. heres the diffence 4l60-700r4 same thing, one piece case 4l60E= electronic/some removeable bellhousings mostly after 99 yes an ecm could be built to shift the tranny how many people r willing to do the tranny swap and build a custom ecm? im still willing to help, but lets make sure people want to go this rought. i would rather adapt the old style nonelectronic also the new style bellhousing is an 8 bolt design (housing to case) very diff from the t5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZPI28 Posted June 14, 2004 Report Share Posted June 14, 2004 I know that Painless sells a lockup kit for the 700R4, not sure if they have one for the 4L60E? This allows lockup without a computer. Steven Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie_Rich Posted June 14, 2004 Report Share Posted June 14, 2004 I called that Sallee Chevrolet in the first link I provided. He mentioned that there is a computer and wiring kit available from Chevrolet that will operete the 4L60-E. The cost is about $900 I'd bet you could find this cheaper somewhere. He also said that the the removable bellhousing is only available in the 4L60-E. I wonder if you could covert the "E" to an non-"E" to benifit from the removable bellhousing. I'd think the Megasquirt system could be adapted to shift the 4L60-E with some work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89onaquest Posted June 14, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2004 Well. You can also just make a pressure sensor circuit that can read the line pressure and provide V out to the gear drivers, but I also really like the idea of the paddle system. But as mentioned, it would be a complete manual nothing auto about it at all. Also, possibly one could adapt the Ford Edis system to act as a shifting driver. I know the MS has several user proramable outputs, on being shift lights. I have also been thinking this should be more of an adapter plate rather then a housing. Opinions/Comments? It would also lower the price substantially. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Too Deep Posted June 14, 2004 Report Share Posted June 14, 2004 Well. You can also just make a pressure sensor circuit that can read the line pressure and provide V out to the gear drivers, but I also really like the idea of the paddle system. But as mentioned, it would be a complete manual nothing auto about it at all. Also, possibly one could adapt the Ford Edis system to act as a shifting driver. I know the MS has several user proramable outputs, on being shift lights. I have also been thinking this should be more of an adapter plate rather then a housing. Opinions/Comments? It would also lower the price substantially. i like the paddle idea, put line pressure control is the main problem.max line pressure is applied by default. a pwm solenoid reduces line pressure when not needed. without it , slams every gear/every time. if your racing this is good, but just putting it in gear chirps the tires. tough on drivetrain comonents adapting a 4l60e to run with non (e) components would be near impossible case is just too different i would prefer the adapter plate to the 4l60- much simpler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Too Deep Posted June 14, 2004 Report Share Posted June 14, 2004 I called that Sallee Chevrolet in the first link I provided. He mentioned that there is a computer and wiring kit available from Chevrolet that will operete the 4L60-E. The cost is about $900 Â I'd bet you could find this cheaper somewhere. He also said that the the removable bellhousing is only available in the 4L60-E. I wonder if you could covert the "E" to an non-"E" to benifit from the removable bellhousing. I'd think the Megasquirt system could be adapted to shift the 4L60-E with some work. If you really wanted to make this work, pick up a pcm and harness from a scrap yard 4l60e car/truck. find a way to mimic gm crank trigger signal, use a gm tps w/standalong management, plug in a map sensor and ect and away u go $900 on the credit card is much simpler though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie_Rich Posted June 14, 2004 Report Share Posted June 14, 2004 I agree an adapter plate would be the cheapest and cover more applications especially if the 700R4, 4L60 and 4L60-E have the same bolt patterns. What do you do about getting a flex plate that could bolt to our cranks? If its a matter of bolting an adapter and getting a custom flex plate, swapping in one these trannies may be doable for me. Fabricating a rear mount and having the drive shaft shortened shouldn't be that big a deal. I can't remember, does the starter bolt ot the engine block on a Chevy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Too Deep Posted June 14, 2004 Report Share Posted June 14, 2004 I agree an adapter plate would be the cheapest and cover more applications especially if the 700R4, 4L60 and 4L60-E have the same bolt patterns. What do you do about getting a flex plate that could bolt to our cranks? If its a matter of bolting an adapter and getting a custom flex plate, swapping in one these trannies may be doable for me. Fabricating a rear mount and having the drive shaft shortened shouldn't be that big a deal. I can't remember, does the starter bolt ot the engine block on a Chevy? engine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89onaquest Posted June 15, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 If you really wanted to make this work, pick up a pcm and harness from a scrap yard 4l60e car/truck. find a way to mimic gm crank trigger signal, use a gm tps w/standalong management, plug in a map sensor and ect and away u go $900 on the credit card is much simpler though. The Ford Edis can do that. It is used in conjuction with MS to run distributorless ignition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89onaquest Posted June 15, 2004 Author Report Share Posted June 15, 2004 Starter bolts to bottom right hand side on SBC. The adapter plate would most certainly be cheaper, also, the 54B has plently of room for the 10-11.5" converters for the GM trannies. All that would have to be done is have the auto flexplate redrilled or maybe not, I do not know that spacing on the quest auto flexplate. SO you would simply run the stock plate possibly needing to have 3/4 new holes drilled. I will try to get a spacer plate off Joe's 87 that he has removed the trans out of and go by a junk yard sometime this week to get measurements off of some 700r's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89onaquest Posted July 9, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2004 Ok, Joe got a buyer/trader for his camaro. We are still waiting for confirmation, but Joe thinks he is going to be getting what he wants. A 700R4. We are hoping to have this within the next 10 days. More like praying actually. Anyway, TPI I still got your bellhousing, I even cleaned it up. Just giving a heads up/ update. Also, I will be going with adapter plates. The 700 plate will have the SBC trans holes, so you can pick your own SBC trans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YELLOWHELL Posted July 10, 2004 Report Share Posted July 10, 2004 I'm changing the 700R4 in my Blazer this weekend. The 700R4 fits the 350 the Vortec 6cyl. and the 2.8 v6 so the bell should be identical to the other chevy tranny's from the same era. The Turbo350 and 400 are the same bolt pattern as the r4 if I'm not mistaken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89onaquest Posted July 11, 2004 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2004 I'm changing the 700R4 in my Blazer this weekend. The 700R4 fits the 350 the Vortec 6cyl. and the 2.8 v6 so the bell should be identical to the other chevy tranny's from the same era. The Turbo350 and 400 are the same bolt pattern as the r4 if I'm not mistaken. Your trans will fit the 90* V6 and the V8's IT WILL NOT fit the V6 2.8/3.1/3.4 they are 60* engines. But yes the 700/TH350/TH400/4L60 are the same bolt pattern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KO Posted July 12, 2004 Report Share Posted July 12, 2004 I'm definitely interested I'd love to be able to slap in a bulletproof auto one of these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroKewl9 Posted July 14, 2004 Report Share Posted July 14, 2004 Ok I havn't read every single post but I did do a search on this whole thread and no one mentioned the 200R4 used by Grand Nationals... why not.. I've got a magazine where they have one built to withstand 900HP!!!! These transmissions have some awesome qualities most other autos do not. #1 Small .. should be able to fit into our trans area #2 Small also means that it takes a lot less power to turn the pump on it .. which means more of our engines power to the wheels #3 These transmissions were made to utilize torque.. and it shows with the wide ratio between gears #4 They have a lower OD gear than ours (ours .68 .. 200R4 .67) #5 No need for a computer as the 60Lx requires .. (don't get me wrong about the computer thing because I have a read up and I know that one could set the shift points for any gear which is a pretty awesome thing) #6 You can get a high stall convter and still have lockup ( yes yes I know the same goes for 60Lx but I needed another entry ) #7 TH200-4Rs offers full-throttle upshifts into overdrive, while only '91 and later Corvette TH700-R4s offer this. (found this on a website) BTW where does this GP stand? .... i'll the rest of my reading now Zero edit: Ok so I went and got some numbers and maybe this kind of stuff will help other people out... Powerglide 1.76 1.00 TH-350 2.52 1.52 1.00 TH-400 2.48 1.48 1.00 700-R4 3.06 1.63 1.00 0.70 200-R4 2.74 1.57 1.00 0.67 4L60 3.06 1.63 1.00 0.70 4L80 2.48 1.48 1.00 0.75 GM 94-97 T-56 Gear ratios: 2.66:1 first, 1.78:1 second, 1.30:1 third, 1.00:1 fourth, .74:1 fifth, .50:1 sixth, and 3.28:1 reverse. Torque capacity: 450 lb-ft. Ford T5 and year from stangs model # , 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, Rev, torque capacity 5-speed T5 (1987-89) E6ZR-7003-FB 3.35 1.93 1.29 1.00 0.675 3.15 265 5-speed T5 (1989) E9ZR-7003-A 3.35 1.99 1.33 1.00 0.675 3.15 300 5-speed T5 (1990) F0ZR-7003-AA 3.35 1.99 1.33 1.00 0.675 3.15 300 5-speed T5 (1991-93) FZZR-7003-AA 3.35 1.99 1.33 1.00 0.675 3.15 300 Hope all this helps some.... Zero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Too Deep Posted July 14, 2004 Report Share Posted July 14, 2004 great info 200r may have some advantage over the 700 cost is not one of them much cheaper to build a stong 700 also good (HP) junkyard 700 parts r much more plentiful the only 200 worth a crap went in the grandnational family(special build) the rest r junk IMHO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroKewl9 Posted July 15, 2004 Report Share Posted July 15, 2004 You do have a point :'( so is this GP already over or what? Zero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KO Posted July 15, 2004 Report Share Posted July 15, 2004 so is this GP already over or what? To my understanding it hasn't even started he is just trying to get an idea on the amount of people interested and what type of tranny to go with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeroKewl9 Posted July 15, 2004 Report Share Posted July 15, 2004 Ah sweet thanks man.. Zero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
armygreen11 Posted July 15, 2004 Report Share Posted July 15, 2004 Interested. My vote is for the T-5. I'm also interested in the 4G63 plate for a T-5 as well whenever that comes to be. armygreen11@comcast.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrdodge01 Posted July 16, 2004 Report Share Posted July 16, 2004 I'd be interested in an adapter for a T-56 Camaro tranny... got a friend with one that I can get cheap with a high dollar clutch and everything ready to go. Did you ever get the bolt pattern for the GM T-56 89onaquest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey_Wulf Posted July 24, 2004 Report Share Posted July 24, 2004 I want the T-56 but we need to be able to go with the Ford gearing. Screw the auto tranny talk for now, start a different thred for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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