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Lightened crank

superscan811

By superscan811,
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superscan811
superscan811

Here are 2 Youtube vids of a sigma, before and after the motorbike carbs.   I loaned a quad carb setup to a group of guys who are doing motorkhana's in an old 1980 Sigma.   The engine is stock standar

89BananaQuest
89BananaQuest

X2 very cool build

CaliConquestAlex Newbie

CaliConquestAlex

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The problem is that there's no oil pathways to keep the feet lubricated. There used to be a link regarding this on the B2600turbo.com website but I can't find it now. I looked into this also, but decided it wasn't worth the risk, my mechanical rockers line up great with the valve tips.

 

EDIT: Here's the link to the B2600turbo post:

 

http://www.b2600turbo.com/swivel%20foot.htm

Edited by CaliConquestAlex
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superscan811 Newbie

superscan811

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There was a problem with swivel feet.. just can't remember what it was or if it was even a problem on this (g54b) engine..

The problem is that there's no oil pathways to keep the feet lubricated.

That is correct BUT I have run them without the oil feed, running double valve springs with a 35-75 long duration cam for over 40k with no problems at all. The only prep done is to pack the oil galley with high molybdenum content grease before installing them.

 

Cheers.

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superscan811 Newbie

superscan811

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Well I picked up my Titanium valved head today (it's only been sitting at the engine conditioners for the last 6 months or so).

Using 2mm oversize valves with 7mm stems, bronze valve guides and Beehive valve springs.

Inlets are 1.89" and the exhaust is 1.53"

It has 2mm larger valve seats as well as Beryllium-Copper exhaust valve seats to help remove the heat from the valves, but the inlet seats are steel because the inlet valves are mainly cooled by the fuel-air mix.

 

The head at the top of the picture has 1mm oversize Stainless valves(for my Turbo build).

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Head/HEADS-Ti-SS.jpg

 

Cleaned up the ports and chamber a bit as well.

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Head/TITANIUM-INLET-PORT.jpg

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Head/TITANIUM-EXHAUST-PORT.jpg

 

 

The weight difference between the valves is HUGE..

 

Standard steel Inlet valve and spring retainer (couldn't find any collets). 121.5 grams

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Head/STEEL-INLET-WEIGHT.jpg

 

 

 

 

Titanium Inlet valve with collet and spring retainer. 64.5 grams

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Head/TITANIUM-INLET-WEIGHT.jpg

 

Almost 1/2 the weight.

 

Have tested the head with a lumpy cam, designed for 12.5:1 CR, and all the valves miss each other.

 

Have to CC the chambers yet and need to dummy assemble the engine to see how much the pistons need to be flycut.

 

Should go well I think.

 

 

 

Cheers.

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superscan811 Newbie

superscan811

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Was asked the question about where I got the valves.

 

Bought them off Ebay. They are ex-nascar (one race only).

 

 

The inlets needed to be shortened, machined and prepped as the face was originally 2", the exhausts just need to be shortened.

 

The valve guides are from the twincam Ford sierra cosworth. They are a bit shorter than standard but apart from that, they are perfect fit.

 

The inlets of the cosworth sierra are 7mm, the exhausts are 8mm, so whether you go for std 8mm or the smaller 7mm valve stems, you're covered.

 

 

BTW: Titanium valves on a turbo engine isn't a great idea. They retain their heat a lot more than steel or stainless. Also, they have a limited life and will fatigue (fail) a lot quicker than steel or stainless.

 

For a Normally aspirated engine, the benefits outweigh the negatives. For a Turbo engine, I'd be looking for the 7mm stem Stainless valves some nascar run and using them, ESPECIALLY on the exhaust.

 

 

Cheers.

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superscan811 Newbie

superscan811

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Some new toys arrived today...

 

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/Rods.jpg

 

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/PPM-Rods.jpg

 

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/Bearings.jpg

 

:D :D :D :D

 

 

Also bought 4 sets of rod and main bearings so I can finally get some of my builds back under way.

 

The rods weigh in at 22.4 ounces each, a bit lighter than the standard 29.3 ounce rods, and probably a little bit stronger as well..

 

 

Cheers.

Edited by superscan811
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cheaterparts Newbie

cheaterparts

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The problem is that there's no oil pathways to keep the feet lubricated. There used to be a link regarding this on the B2600turbo.com website but I can't find it now. I looked into this also, but decided it wasn't worth the risk, my mechanical rockers line up great with the valve tips.

 

just like scott ( superscan811 ) I've had no problem running the swivel feet that is on a bigger cam 296 deg inlet and 310 deg ex

and more lift - included double valve springs

 

I had thought of changing to a 53/83 in and 87/49 ex with 0.480 valve lift and the only way to keep ends on the adjuster bolt is to use the swivel feet

 

 

 

 

You will gain more removing weight from the outside of the flywheel than you will removing it from the crank.

 

I've removed around 7lbs out of the flywheel and at least 90% of that is from the outer 2".

 

To achieve the same gain you would have to remove approx 14lb from the outer edges of the crank.

 

Removed around 8lbs from the crank, and even if I drilled out the big ends, I doubt I could safely remove more than another 3lbs without sacrificing reliability.

 

Also, it's a 1.5 hour job to remove the weight from the flywheel, but it takes at least 2 days (for me) to lighten the crank.

 

 

 

I agree with scott I also dont like aluminium flywheels and steel can be quite light

here one I made at home in the shed its 1 pound heavier than the one I use myself

 

and I have made a lighter fly wheel to match with a tilton 7 1/4 " single plate

thats a bit over 4 kg ( 8.8 pound ) matched to a 2.3 kg clutch ( 5 and a bit pound )

I

http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/5576/flywheel003.th.jpg

finished flywheel back from the balancers

 

 

http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/7567/flywheel001.th.jpg

total weight 5.06 Kg ( 11.14 Lbs ) that include the presure plate bolts

and with the weight removed from the outter edge they even feel like they are lighter

to drive

 

I hadn't read this post for a while - Scott ditch that cast flywheel or I ment keep it if it's going on you race engine just incase we ever get to the same track at the same time

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Skullzaflare Newbie

Skullzaflare

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That looks like some pretty serious work been done to that crank.

 

Looks good.

 

 

Not yet, Still waiting on the rods.

 

I need them to accurately measure the piston height.

 

Just as a comparison, here is a pic of the height difference.

 

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Pistons/4G54-22R.jpg

 

 

The one on the left is for my turbo 4G54, the one on the right is for my Hi Comp 4G54. Its a 22R piston.

 

there is a .14" difference in compression height and the 22R piston already has a 24.7cc dome. I am wanting to get the pistons .012" above deck which means I'll need to chamfer the edges a bit and probably flycut for the valve relief.

 

All fun but I want the rods first before I start cutting.

 

Cheers.

what is the pin bore on those 22r pistons? what do you think a set of flattop 22r pistons would raise our compression to? around 10.5:1?

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superscan811 Newbie

superscan811

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Sorry for the long delay in responding, I don't always check back here.

 

Life in general has got in the way of this project but I've set my self a goal of mid March to complete the engine.

 

Haven't been completely idle, I've put a set of 40mm motorbike carbs on my Triton Ute, encountering and solving a few issues along the way.

 

Main problem was the vacuum signal was too low to be able to use the vacuum advance. Answer, EDIS...

http://110.174.47.143/SG/EDIS/FAN-SPACER.jpg

 

 

 

 

The next problem was over fueling on light throttle ie:cruising. Solution, machine the slides a little.

 

From this..

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Motorbike_carbs/40mm%20Slide-STD.jpg

 

To this..

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Motorbike_carbs/40mm%20Slide-MOD.jpg

 

 

Youtube vid of the

and

 

The only "performance mods" to the engine is the carbs, exhaust and EDIS. Apart from that it is a 100% stock engine that has done over 220,000 miles.

BTW: with the first vid, the engine was cold so it was idling a bit low, around 500rpm with no choke, that's why it's bouncing around.

 

 

 

what is the pin bore on those 22r pistons?
Same, 0.8661" (22mm)

 

 

what do you think a set of flattop 22r pistons would raise our compression to? around 10.5:1?
The flat tops would lower the comp because they are between .0040" to .0060" lower compression height compared to the standard 4g54 pistons.

 

The pistons I'm using are for the 1981-1982 22R engines.

 

 

 

 

Cheers.

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superscan811 Newbie

superscan811

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There has been some progress on my High comp engine due mainly to my Utes No:2 exhaust valve guide doing a disappearing act, and sucking in 1/2 gallon of oil. Not good for the cars behind me. :lol:

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Head/No-Valve%20Guide.jpg

 

There was minimal damage to the head.

http://110.174.47.143/SG/Head/No-Valve%20Guide%20seat..jpg

An oversize valve guide, a seat re-cut and all will be good. Even the Stainless valve doesn't have any damage to it, although I definitely won't use it again.

The main reason I think it survived so well was the Swivel foot adjusters, because they don't tend to push the valve sideways as much as standard tappets.

 

 

 

Anyway, here are some pics of the build so far....

 

The rods and piston.

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/HC-Piston%20and%20Rod.jpg

 

 

The bottom end all together.

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/HC-Bottom%20end.jpg

 

 

I machined the outer edge of the 22R pistons so they will fit inside the head combustion chamber Comp ratio should be around 14:1.

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/HC-Piston%20height%20at%20TDC.jpg

 

 

The Magna M7 head will be receiving a big valve upgrade, inlets will be 51.3mm (2.020") and exhaust will be 40.6mm (1.600"). These are Performance SBC Stainless valves with 7mm stems (8mm is standard for the Astron engines), and to make sure they play nice with the pistons and each other, the oversize valve seats (4140 chromoly for a VW) will be recessed an extra 2mm (.080").

 

Can't wait to get this together.

 

 

 

Cheers.

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superscan811 Newbie

superscan811

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Whoa, those are some high-domed pistons!

Needed to achieve 14:1..

 

Some more bits arrived today

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/SBC-Valves.jpg

 

The exhaust is only 2.5mm (0.100") larger than standard

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/SBC-Exh_Compare.jpg

 

 

but the inlets are 5mm (0.200") larger

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/SBC-Inlet_compare.jpg

 

 

The 2 M7 heads have had the VW valve seats installed so a bit of porting is now required

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/VW-Valve_seats-Installed.jpg

 

 

This is my M8 head with 1mm OS valves in it

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/1mm-OS.jpg

 

Same head with the SBC valves placed there

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/SBC-HEAD-1.jpg

 

The clearance, in between the valves will be a lot larger when the seats are cut .080" deeper than standard. The other benefit is the pistons may not have to be flycut, hopefully...

 

 

Cheers.

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superscan811 Newbie

superscan811

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For a better impression on how the valves fit.

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/SBC-Test_fit.jpg

 

It looks like there will be around .160" clearance inbetween the valves.

While the inlet is sitting flush in this pic, the M8 head has had .090" shaved off it AND the valves aren't properly seated, so they should end up sitting around .150" lower in the other heads I'm preparing.

http://110.174.47.143/SG/HC-ENGINE/SBC-Test_fit-01.jpg

 

This all bodes well for no further machining required for the pistons.

 

 

 

Cheers.

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