New to the 88' Starion

[Starheel]

First off I am new to the Starion and pretty much new to any work beyond basic maintenance. I recently purchased a 1988 Starion because I like the look and uniqueness. I could also purchase the car and get it running fast cheaper than other cars I had in mind.

 

So i purchased a car with 88K on the odometer and was already rebuilt about 10K ago. It has been sitting a while but runs OK. It already has coil overs, and manual boost controller, and stereo. It idles rough and does not idle high then come back down as it gets warm, it just starts low and wants to stall out. I just give it some gas for about a minute and then it is fine but still idles rough.

 

I see others that will spin the wheels or want to at least, in one there is no way that is happening. From a stop it is very slow, like my jetta or SUV, but when it gets to about 2500 RPM the turbo kicks in and it runs pretty good or at least better and fast than lower RPMs. And i guess this is fuel cut but it seems to shudder or mis fire at about 4500 to 5000 RPM. Unfortunatly the car is also automatic and the shifts are pretty hard and doesn't want to down shift when passing. I have to put it to the floor to down shift or to accelerate as fast as my Jetta. (until the turbo kicks in)

 

I have changed the oil and diff oil already and notice the tranny has a leak. I plan on changing the tranny fluid and tranny filter, the fuel filter, and test compression. I guess i need to test the ISC and TPS as well and have a ECI checker but not the extra harness the manual talks about. I see that there are ways to check them without the ECI checker, but i would like to do it my the manual. I also think there could be something wrong with the injectors but they are semi recent python injectors.

 

eventually i want to upgrade the fuel pump, go full hard pipes with BOV, GM MAF and translator, 2.5 or 3 inch exhaust, A/F meter, and i have a extra head that i would get worked on and go with stainless valves, better springs, and upgraded CAM.

 

Any help or input from you guys would great and i will work on getting some pictures up int eh next couple days.

[jjohnson]

Welcome go to the main page scroll down to new owners go in there then go to the checklist and start there

[Starion86ESI]

-Do a tps reset. Adjust the idle using the Factory Service Manual (www.starquestgarage.com)

-Check for vacuum leaks

-I had an auto and you won't spin any wheel with it unless you brake torque

[importwarrior]

basic maintenance make sure it runs 100% before you mod.

make sure there are no exhaust leaks.

exhaust manifold to head.. the studs can come lose and or strip out of the head if over torqued.

manifold to turbo

turbo to down pipe.

 

if so you can get some boost related driving issues.

Edited November 15, 2013 by importwarrior

[Scotty Dont]

All of these cars need to be gone threw by the new owner. Verify the cam is timed properly then verify the ignitions is timed. Go threw the distributor and clean the weights and springs. From there replace all of the vacuum lines, this stuff is free/cheap and will almost always make the car run WAY better. If you are running the original exhaust there is a high possiblity that the cats are clogged up so that should be one of your first mods as well.

[Starfighterpilot]

In addition to the above replies, first off I would check to see if you have any ECI computer error codes, which will indicate if you have a problem with the correct operation of the engine coolant temperature sensor, the ISC & MPS and the O₂ sensor. See the FSM and the FAQ's on how to do this.

 

I would also look at this link which has links to the FSM & the 87/88 Starquest Parts Catalog for down loading and your reading pleasure. http://www.starquest...hp?showforum=56

 

Welcome to the Wonderful World Of Starquests.

 

Let us know what you find.

 

For What it's Worth.

 

KEN

[Starheel]

UPDATE:

 

I didnt have as much time as i was anticipating so I took it to my car guy to go through some stuff. He replaced the trans fluid and filter, replaced the fuel filter, checked the timing, replaced the vaccum advance, replaced spark pkug wires, and made sure the vaccum tubing was correct. During the vaccum tubing corrections he took out the previous owners manual boost controller.

 

The car runs much better on the low end now, but if i get on it, at about 3500 RPM and 12psi, the car just stops accelerating. It will stay right at those numbers until i let off the gas or the trans decides to shift, lowering the RPM. Not having much experience with turbo cars, is this just getting to the stock turbo cut off, or fuel cut, or what? any ideas?

 

How do you tell what year the ECU came from? the car was cutting out when the wheels were turned sharp so i replaced the ecu with the other i had on hand, and it seemed to fix the issue.

 

i have tried to get the 12v led to hook up the ecu test port with no luck, so i will try that again. also the muffler is rusted out, so i guess i will replace the whole exhaust system to a 2.5". Any recommendations for a downpipe, that doesn't rattle, and a cheap cat i can put on and gut(i dont know anyone that will pass me without the cat in place). There seem to be plenty of cat back systems out there on the web.

 

I will trying to do some testing and sweep testing coming up soon and opening up the air filter housing. Any where for instructions on manual boost control install?

 

i will be trying to upload some photos and maybe a video of the car soon as well.

[Guest]

Welcome to the addiction! 3500RPM issues are usually related to vaccum advance. But you say that was replaced. Do you know if it was a used or new unit?

[Starheel]

The vac advance was new.

I am going to try and link some pics and then after lunch I hope to have a vid of the problem.

[Starheel]

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae309/mjomorgan/1DCDFBD9-025C-4F81-B0EE-765379F12016.jpg

 

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae309/mjomorgan/D71681DB-E02F-49B8-A3F9-240F429A551B.jpg

 

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae309/mjomorgan/8537251B-924A-4AFD-B5B7-7A97830D3D28.jpg

 

 

[Starheel]

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae309/mjomorgan/D71681DB-E02F-49B8-A3F9-240F429A551B.jpg

 

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae309/mjomorgan/8537251B-924A-4AFD-B5B7-7A97830D3D28.jpg

 

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae309/mjomorgan/1DCDFBD9-025C-4F81-B0EE-765379F12016.jpg

 

http://i982.photobucket.com/albums/ae309/mjomorgan/1B178CB0-21BE-4586-BBD5-FDA614364FE5.jpg

[importwarrior]

did you have the mechanic change the fuel filter? there is also one called a conicle or cone filter before the fuel pump.

it gets clogged and acts as if fuel cut is going on.

it basically is due to the the cone or conicle filter being clogged limiting fuel.

you will get fuel starvation if clogged.

 

Located in the rear hatch - trunk floor, driver side. pics 3-5-6-7 show where this cone filter is located. click the link below.

http://www.starquest...howtopic=132001

Edited January 2, 2014 by importwarrior

[Starheel]

ok video link:

 

sorry my phone did not want to focus on teh first 2 runs. They weren't WOT but they were pretty normal high acceleration for street driving, like having to beat someone off a light because your lane runs out type stuff.

 

and yes the mechanic changed the the fuel filter, i guess the conical filter will be on my list as well to get to.

[vbrad511]

Was the vacuum advance be correct one? Our cars VA activates with both positive and negative pressure, not like a NA car.

[importwarrior]

dont wait too long on the conicle or cone filter.

it can really make a huge difference if clogged up like mine was.

 

how much boost are you running?

i feel you need to get some gauges for monitoring.

wide band A-F gauge

boost gauge.

get them hooked up and then see whats really going on

other wise it is a guessing game.

if too much boost you could blow out the spark.

proper gap for spark plugs is about .032 to .028.

thats about what i run.

Edited January 3, 2014 by importwarrior

[Starheel]

I dont know how much boost im running. The sputtering seems to happen around 10 or 12 psi on my gauge. Who knows if my gauge is right. Also could it be fuel cut if the ecu that was switched wasan older model?

 

So i guess i will be gapping plugs, adding gauges, and cleaning the conical filter. Is it wort it to go ahead and change the fuel pump the the bigger wahlboro? I would eventually like this to be a DD around 300hp.

[Starheel]

Should you be able to move the waste gate with your hands? I have tried to push and pull on the actuator linkage but it doesn't budge.

[Starheel]

Today I am going to get an estimate for a 2.5" exhaust from my local muffler shop. Should they be able to make a down pipe too? I will probably go with a high flow cat as well, for inspection purposes. Is straight pipe too loud should a muffler be put on as well?

 

IF a new down pipe is put on I guess the EGR will then be deleted. Can all fluids still be in the car when the EGR valve is taken off? i dont want to take it off and some thing start leaking everywhere.

 

So this weekend I hope to gap the plugs, and add a MSD coil.

 

It looks like I am not getting very good gas mileage either, like around 12MPG, so im thinking its running rich since there doesn't seem to be any leakage that I have noticed. Is there something to check for that or would adding the 3" GM MAF and MAFT that I got be able to tune that out?

 

I guess i need to figure out what year my 2 ECU's are from as well.

 

anyways help would be appreciated. thanks.

[Starheel]

Well maybe one day someone will read this again and have some insight.

 

i did install the MSD coil, it says if installing on a points ignition system that you would need a resistor. do have a points ignition?

 

i also gapped the plugs to 0.030. the front cylinder plug looked a little fouled. I did not have another to i cleaned it and put it back in. What would cause that? on that cylinder?

 

still working on the boost gauge, conical filter, and cutting an area open on the air can for better flow.

 

also to the wastegate question above is there another way to test it? i think maybe it is not working and therefore blowing the spark out.

 

want to get it going so i can put on my maft and 3" gm maf and the 16g turbo i have. also the exhaust place quoted my 5 or 6 hundred dollars and suggested 2.25". i think it would be easier to get the propose down pipe and cat back and just get the local shop to do the b-pipe?

[TexasQuest]

No we don't have points ignition. Just install it like the old one. That's way too much money for that size exhaust imo. 2.25 is the factory size, you'll want to go with 2 1/2 or 3".

[Starfighterpilot]

You probably need to have the fuel injectors cleaned, in sounds like the secondary one may be dirty or gummed up. Also check the injector clips to verify that they seat tightly on the injectors, and the injector male and the injector clip's female connectors metal terminals are shiny squeeky clean.

 

Like was mentioned above, our Starquests need a different vacuum advance than the NA G54B engines due to boost pressure that the vacuum advance sees. The Mitsu Part number for the correct one for your '88 Starion is MD611769. Verfy on your invoice from your mechanic that that is the vacuum advance that was installed.

 

You may be onto something with the cats being clogged up - ESPECIALLY THE PRIMARY PRE CAT JUST DOWNSTREAM OF THE TURBO WASTE GATE which is notorious for clogging. If that one is clogged up you will have an extreme reduction in flow of the exhaust gases through it which will cause the acceleration symptoms you are describing. You can save yourself some bucks by just gutting it. Your Lady will still pass smog. I gutted mine in 2001 and passed smog with flying colors for the next 12 years. After you gut it, the car feels like it's brand new.

 

See this link which discusses gutting of the pre cat. http://starquest.i-x...5c4c41c172388fc

 

For What It's Worth.

 

KEN

 

PS - I just reread your OP. The engine was rebuilt about 10K miles ago. If the reason that the engine was rebuilt was that the head cracked, then I would especially suspect that the pre cat is clogged up. One of the main reasons for pre cat clogging is the engine coolant that went through it while it was running with the cracked head.

[Starheel]

Thanks guys for more info.

 

Yes my plan was to get the injectors flowed and tested when i have the tank down to get to the conical filter ( all fuel system work ). should i go ahead with a high flow fuel pump or keep the stock pump? it seems to be pumping fine.

 

Also not sure what gave you the impression i was thinking it was the pre-cat? The PO, who rebuilt the motor, said he gutted the cats, but the whole exhaust system is now looking rough. That is why I was asking if I could get a custom exhaust done cheaper than just getting the propose101 down pipe and cat back, and getting the shop to do the pipe between?

 

Another problem I think i have is that I can't move the wastegate. I think it is stuck but need to know whats the best way to easily test it? should i get a hand vacuum pump and test it?

 

i want to get the car functioning properly before I add the 3" MAF, exhaust, and 16g turbo.

 

thanks again for the knowledge.

[Starfighterpilot]

Thanks guys for more info.

 

Yes my plan was to get the injectors flowed and tested when i have the tank down to get to the conical filter ( all fuel system work ). should i go ahead with a high flow fuel pump or keep the stock pump? it seems to be pumping fine.

 

Also not sure what gave you the impression i was thinking it was the pre-cat? The PO, who rebuilt the motor, said he gutted the cats, but the whole exhaust system is now looking rough. That is why I was asking if I could get a custom exhaust done cheaper than just getting the propose101 down pipe and cat back, and getting the shop to do the pipe between?

 

Another problem I think i have is that I can't move the wastegate. I think it is stuck but need to know whats the best way to easily test it? should i get a hand vacuum pump and test it?

 

i want to get the car functioning properly before I add the 3" MAF, exhaust, and 16g turbo.

 

thanks again for the knowledge.

 

You don't need to drop the tank to get to the conical filter. There is an access plate to the fuel pump in the bottom of the rear hatch area. See this link http://starquest.i-x...9a9f07f4aaee73e

While you are in there around the pump pull the suction pick up strainer in the tank and see if it's clogged up with debris; and change the suction hosegoing to the fuel pump with ethanol resistant hose. It's 26 years old, may be dry rotted and it's been exposed to the crappy ethanol gas we have to use today. The ethanol eats up the internals of the fuel hoses.

 

You have to disconnect the turbo waste gate actuator linkage from the waste gate lever in order to move the waste gate. The actuator holds it shut with a LOT of force. After you get the linkage off you'll need a small set of vice grips to get the linkage back on the lever.

 

It's been shown many times over the years that the OEM Starquest fuel pump supplies sufficient gas at the required fuel pressure to support 350 HP in our G54B T engines. But that's your call to replace it. But there a many fuel pumps that ain't worth the powder to blow 'em to hell & back - especially the ones made in Red China. The above link discusses that.

 

For What It's Worth.

 

KEN

[Starheel]

OK going to try and get some stuff done this weekend, but i was looking at getting a hard OVCP. The only one I can find is http://www.protuninglab.com/inhawgrflstc.html . Does this seem like a good product? Also, I don't want a BOV, at least not right now, so does anyone sell a block-off plate for the BOV mount on this pipe.

 

And what about a hard pipe from the turbo to intercooler? anyone have these available or is it more of a fabricate yourself deal.

[Starfighterpilot]

OK going to try and get some stuff done this weekend, but i was looking at getting a hard OVCP. The only one I can find is http://www.protuning...hawgrflstc.html . Does this seem like a good product? Also, I don't want a BOV, at least not right now, so does anyone sell a block-off plate for the BOV mount on this pipe.

 

And what about a hard pipe from the turbo to intercooler? anyone have these available or is it more of a fabricate yourself deal.

 

I suggest that you post in the Parts Wanted Forum and look in the Parts for Sale Forum.

 

For What It's Worth.

 

KEN