drift_king Posted June 13, 2015 Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 (edited) wuttup starquesters. For the first time in years my conquest ran under its own power and idled. Let me tell you, It was exciting and scary at the same time. Since I'm running 1800cc injectors it was running at 10.0 rich on my AEM wideband. I have no idea what my next step is exactly. So for i have completed these steps in my checklist. - Start-up configuration- Setup tables for rpm/load- Configure the ignition table- First start fluid/ boostleak checks. I have started the engine and I'm ready to adjust idle afr. I'm assuming I use the warmup enrichment features to set the idle AFR, however all I've found online for information was how to richen the idle, not lean it out. my car is really drowning in fuel. iplan toupdate this thread and keepitgoing so other people can use it for a source of information. I took a datalog and it was very confusing using megalog viewer. Since its running so Rich should close the pulsewidth settings. or tune the Afrs leaner in the VE table.? What are peopleusing for a warm-up tool in tuner studio. idle was around 1550 for the few minuets I ran it, is there any way to get that down? and afr was 8.1. I let the coolant get to 133 degrees. Edited June 16, 2015 by drift_king Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drift_king Posted June 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 (edited) f Edited June 13, 2015 by drift_king Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeMeyerhoff Posted June 13, 2015 Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 Congrats on getting it running. I can't help as much as others, but some general advice: let it warm up and start tuning the base areas of the VE table. Once you have the ve table decent, then you can tune the afterstart and warmup. Not the other way around. Another thing I've picked up on that wasn't really intuitive is that you want the warm idle pulsewith close to 2ms. The farther away from that, the more likely you've got something set wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarquestRescue Posted June 13, 2015 Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 Work with scott87star on here. Tbi? Ms version? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psu_Crash Posted June 13, 2015 Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 I wouldn't be too concerned with warm up entichment at this point unless you have some crazy values in the WUE table. Concentrate on the VE table. Once it fires up start changing the bins where it is running at to get idle AFR in range. I shoot for about 13.5 @ warm idle. Seems to like it there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drift_king Posted June 13, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2015 (edited) Hmm playing with it right now. I can't get the idle down below 2000 rpms. Guess I'll start with another boost leak check in the morning. Also I synced the tps to megasquirt. The tps's low value was 22, and its high value was 247. Should my low value be lower than that. I'm thinking my thottle may be slightly open. Also tomorrow I will snag my timing light. I set the timing to 10° bdc, however tuner studio was saying it was at 27° while running. Edited June 13, 2015 by drift_king Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psu_Crash Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Those TPS values are fine. That is showing the raw data. It would only be 0 if the TPS output 0 volts, which it never does.The idle issue sure sounds like a boost leak. Running any kind of idle control? IAC, stepper ... etc? Even with timing advanced I don't think it will idle that high. Definitely check that your throttle is closing all the way too.I am also assuming you set the trigger angle in MS to match the actual timing of the engine? In MS you can set a static value of say 10 BTDC so that it always thinks it is running that timing. Then you grab the light to see where you really are. Adjust the trigger angle in MS until the light reads 10 degrees BTDC. After that make sure to set the timing back to use the table. Then it will run whatever timing angle you have set up in the advance table. Edited June 14, 2015 by psu_Crash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polarisman14 Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 Yeah I wanna say mine is around 60 or so but my IAC valve is disabled so it requires cracking the throttle open slightly to get it to idle. I second Starquestrescue's suggestion to work with Scott87star. Remote tuning is a bit of work in that it requires a lot of back and fourth with the datalogs but the end result is well worth it. With a dyno tune you get something that idles well and goes WOT well, but with remote tuning the finished product is better. If you find an issue with a certain data point (say cruising at 2k rpms at part throttle in fourth uphill) then you just datalog that problem area and he'll tune around it. I would suggest shelling out the coin for a copy of TunerStudio if you haven't already as it is much more user friendly than MegaTune. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drift_king Posted June 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) I don't want to burden lil ol Scotty with my problems lol. I really want to learn how to tune, I want to help my friends with their cars and not have to pay thousands to dyno guys. I have a quick question. Can you burn the tune to the ecu while the car is running or do you need to have the car off because I tried editing my VE table at 2k rpms for a quick change but I couldn't get the burn to go through. Also when editing the VE table and you click on what cells you want to edit, what numbers are you using can you adjust it by using the number 5 to alter the boxes by 5% less or do you use the number 95 to use the injector at 95% of what you would before. I did not set the trigger angle, so a boost leak test and trigger angle tommorow morning. I guess I only set the dizzy to 10btdc when I was cranking the engine. Edited June 14, 2015 by drift_king Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott87star Posted June 14, 2015 Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 You can burn while running, the motor will likely hiccup for a second but no harm done. Use Save As alot, when I'm done tuning a car there are probably 50-60 tune files in the folder. VE values in the table are related to the Required_Fuel number on the constants page, required fuel is the injector pulse width when the engine is running at 100% VE (which it rarely is) so if you have a cell at say 45 in the VE table that means the pulse width at that point will be 45% of the Required_Fuel constant. Example, I like to start a stock Starquest out at 13 mS Required fuel and I generally find the idle area is in the high 20's VE which gives 13-13.5 AFR and around a 3.5 mS pulse width on the stock injector. NOW, you have massive injectors so what Mike said above comes into play, when you find your pulse width getting smaller than 2.0 at idle you will start to have problems, that is because it takes time for the injector to open and close. Typical dead times, the time it takes to open, range from 0.85-1.2 mS and you can see that if the total time is 2.0 mS over half of that is the injector opening and closing so fuel is only spraying less than a milisecond and there are no injectors that exist that are linear with fuel delivery at less than a milisecond. The more expensive injectors like Injector Dynamics give you an actual flow chart and the more expensive ECU's like MS3 give you the ability to use that flow chart at short pulse widths. If you can't get your idle AFR up to at least 12 you may have to use a smaller injector as a primary and one of the 1800's as a secondary. Getting a good idle is understanding the interplay between air flow, timing and fuel. Sync your timing by setting the fixed timing to 10 which will hold timing at what the ECU thinks is 10 no matter what the rpm, get it running and set the distributor so you get 10 BTDC at the crank pulley. Then back down the bleed screw on the throttle body and take out as much fuel as you can. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drift_king Posted June 14, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2015 (edited) Worked the the car today and had some great results. Turns out I only hand tightend my IAT sensor and it was leaking air. I had a leak coming from my intake and a leak coming from the top screw on my bov. Started her back up and got it to idle relatively dencently at 700 to 800 with a hunting AFR of 12.5 - 13.5 but the car kept missing pretty periodically, by jumping to 2200 rpms for a split second on my data log. It felt good to have it run correctly.Can anyone verify if a CLT temp of 197 is decent? I have to work on the next step, whatever that is.... But for today I feel accomplished. Thank you guys for the help, I can't do this stuff alone haha. I have a nice mpi Intake complete with injectors and sensors sitting in my garage right now. Something is telling me scrap this tbi, and switch directly to mpi. What do you guys think? Edited June 15, 2015 by drift_king Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psu_Crash Posted June 15, 2015 Report Share Posted June 15, 2015 I first went to MS on a stock TBI system and ran that way for a month or so to get used to how it all works. Then I swapped in the MPI intake.I recommend getting things tuned in decent now before installing the MPI intake. The experience will come in handy when swapping over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drift_king Posted June 16, 2015 Author Report Share Posted June 16, 2015 (edited) Well I decided to rip the TBI off and go straight to mpi. It's a chad intake. I'm going to mod the water pipe and weld the lower port shut shown here. my turbo is oil cooled only and the manifold can't accept the lower heater hose. Can anybody tell me what thermostat fits in a Chad intake? http://i.imgur.com/juRh4X4.jpg Edited June 16, 2015 by drift_king Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psu_Crash Posted June 20, 2015 Report Share Posted June 20, 2015 I run that line to a fitting on the thermostat housing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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