Low White N Boosted Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 What's up everyone, it's been probably 2 years since my last post on starquestclub.. Hope everything is good in 2009. The forum looks good, it's definitely more user friendly now. Anyway I'll get to the point. About 2 years ago I got a cracked head on my 1987 conquest and we replaced it with a new one. During the rebuild we replaced all the gaskets and did the balance shaft removal kit. For a while it wasn't starting and we couldn't figure out why so I took it to a shop and they said my security system was cutting off my ignition so they rewired it and now my car is starting up and on the road again. It's running pretty decent, a little rich I think... My brother welded a new cat on for me during the rebuild and I still can't pass emissions. I replaced the EGR and all the stock emissions components are still in the car. I have a 1gmas, hks 2.5 exhaust with a 2.5inch high flow cat, 2.5 *DM downpipe, the motor is basically stock except with a new head and the BSE kit done. Also my air condiitoning is gone, I don't know if that matters. I took it through emissions once and failed not too bad, but then I went through with alcohol in my tank and it made my results higher than the first failure with no alcohol I didn't get it. I put a quart of s-l-x denatured alcohol in about a quarter tank of premium and I did this once before and passed wayyyyy under the legal standard. This time it was over the amount when I took the test with nothing in the gas. I didn't get that at all. I think it might be an old gas issue, so I filled the tank up with premium and I'm going to put this CRC Guaranteed to Pass addative in the tank and run it through, then it says to fill the tank up after you ran it through and go take emissions. So i'm going to try that and see what happens. If anyone has any ideas for me to try I'd like to hear them. I think ever since I put my 1gmas on my car has been running rich.... I think my last resort will be to replace the stock ECU with one of those injector kits. Any help is appreciated greatly, Kyle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie_Rich Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 What's up everyone, it's been probably 2 years since my last post on starquestclub.. Hope everything is good in 2009. The forum looks good, it's definitely more user friendly now. Anyway I'll get to the point. About 2 years ago I got a cracked head on my 1987 conquest and we replaced it with a new one. During the rebuild we replaced all the gaskets and did the balance shaft removal kit. For a while it wasn't starting and we couldn't figure out why so I took it to a shop and they said my security system was cutting off my ignition so they rewired it and now my car is starting up and on the road again. It's running pretty decent, a little rich I think... My brother welded a new cat on for me during the rebuild and I still can't pass emissions. I replaced the EGR and all the stock emissions components are still in the car. I have a 1gmas, hks 2.5 exhaust with a 2.5inch high flow cat, 2.5 *DM downpipe, the motor is basically stock except with a new head and the BSE kit done. Also my air condiitoning is gone, I don't know if that matters. I took it through emissions once and failed not too bad, but then I went through with alcohol in my tank and it made my results higher than the first failure with no alcohol I didn't get it. I put a quart of s-l-x denatured alcohol in about a quarter tank of premium and I did this once before and passed wayyyyy under the legal standard. This time it was over the amount when I took the test with nothing in the gas. I didn't get that at all. I think it might be an old gas issue, so I filled the tank up with premium and I'm going to put this CRC Guaranteed to Pass addative in the tank and run it through, then it says to fill the tank up after you ran it through and go take emissions. So i'm going to try that and see what happens. If anyone has any ideas for me to try I'd like to hear them. I think ever since I put my 1gmas on my car has been running rich.... I think my last resort will be to replace the stock ECU with one of those injector kits. Any help is appreciated greatly, Kyle When I had to emission test my car, I always put the stock mas back on or it would fail. A friend of mine did pass once with his 1gmas though. You may want to through another O2 sensor in. Make sure your timing is right on and your injectors are not leaking. I assume you have new plugs and good cap & Rotor and wires. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott87star Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 Post up the numbers, you say its high but without knowing whether it's failing for NOx, CO or HC we can't diagnose it. Also check the ECU codes to see what the computer thinks is going on, wait until its warm otherwise you will get the O2 code. Scott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tubbs Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 i dont know too much from the mechanics stand point, but i do agree. make sure the plugs, wires, etc, are up to good standards. i would do the stock mass air sensor and set it to low boost. when i did mine, i took the test pipe off and put the cat in, set it to low boost, and ran the stock mass air, used plain ol' supreme from chevron, and passed exceedingly. i know soulja620 on here told me he passed with his built motor and eliminated tons of his emissions stuff. i gotta do emissions too this month, time to swap out the goods!!! by the way, where in az are you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustPaus_88TSi Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 He lives in Scottsdale, unless he moved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tubbs Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 awesome. i just noticed you're in gilbert too. lets get something goin man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
on3 racing Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 (edited) well you are being counter productive. you need to figure out what you need to lower. high octane will lower one number while alcohol will lower the other. i live in AZ as well, when i have to run my mustang through i have to use alcohol because it has to much h2(if i remember correctly) so i run next to no gas the run denatured alcohol. the problem is when you do this the co's go way up so you then have to raise the idle real high and lower the timing real low to lower the co's. im not telling you to do this on you starquest, because i have no idea what it would do on a turbo application just letting you know what i have done in the past. post up your numbers, or a scan of the sheet and it will be easier to help you out. some time it can be a very easy fix. i know my toyota will not pass unless it has new plugs. but it will pass with flying colors when they are new. weird but true. or register you car in yuma! Edited January 7, 2009 by on3 racing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xtreme Industries Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 put the stock mas back in it and try it. if i remeber correctly, the 1 g mas lets more fuel go through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low White N Boosted Posted January 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2009 Hey everybody, thanks for the input. Yeah, i still live in Scottsdale/Tempe area. Plugs, wires, coil, cap&rotor are all brand new. Injectors are not leaking and I don't have my stock MAS anymore.. Here are the numbers from my last test: HC 3.18 CO 30.08 NOX 3.48 I have to get them under these numbers HC 1.6 CO 15 NOX 2.5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low White N Boosted Posted January 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2009 Hey everybody, thanks for the input. Yeah, i still live in Scottsdale/Tempe area. Plugs, wires, coil, cap&rotor are all brand new. Injectors are not leaking and I don't have my stock MAS anymore.. Here are the numbers from my last test: HC 3.18 CO 30.08 NOX 3.48 I have to get them under these numbers HC 1.6 CO 15 NOX 2.5 also, I drove around today for a while and after about 30-45 minutes when I would hit boost my car would bog down and start hesitating really bad like jerking as soon as I'd hit any boost. If i kept it under 0 boost that would be the only way I could rev up. As soon as I would go WOT it would start bogging down and wouldn't go anywhere, felt like it was gonna backfire really bad or something. It only would happen once I had been driving for a while. When I first started driving around I could go full throttle to 6k rpms with no problem, after a while I had a hard time getting it above 4000 because of that problem that would start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustPaus_88TSi Posted January 13, 2009 Report Share Posted January 13, 2009 Sounds like a heat related issue, possibly with the pump. When was the last time you checked out the filters back there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edde Posted January 13, 2009 Report Share Posted January 13, 2009 You'll never get those numbers down enough with that 1g mas. Gotta keep the next stock mas you buy :biggrinumbrella1: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low White N Boosted Posted January 13, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2009 i can't be too sure those numbers are that accurate. Those numbers are from the time I took the test with alcohol in my tank. The time before that was on old gas and the numbers were lower.. John, I'm not sure what u mean, which filters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustPaus_88TSi Posted January 13, 2009 Report Share Posted January 13, 2009 It might be nothing, but the filters i'm thinking of are the conical and sock filters. One in the supply line right before the pump, and the other is on the end of the pickup tube in the tank. Usually, the conical filter will get a hair like substance trapped in it, and will seriously prohibit fuel flow. But that would likely cause serious issues when you're trying to get into boost. I'm thinking there's a slim chance that there's not enough blockage in the conical filter to hurt your on-boost performance, but enough to make the pump work harder and thus heating the pump up to the point that it starts to decrease it's pumping ability. Again though, it's a slim chance. How old is the pump? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starion1991 Posted January 13, 2009 Report Share Posted January 13, 2009 Im also in az, I can get your car registered with out going through emissions bull crap, PM me We need az events!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tubbs Posted January 13, 2009 Report Share Posted January 13, 2009 hey man, i have if you need a stock mass air, let me know, i'll let you borrow it for a emissions, just to see what it does. thats what i kept mine for!!! or check with starion1991, which ever is closer, im in the west valley/tolleson/avondale area. about the the bogging issue, i recently started having a similar issue. i cant punch it or else i boggs like no other, i'll try those filters and pump though. it used to happen selectively, but now it does it all the time if i dont ease into it. let me know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low White N Boosted Posted March 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 (edited) Okay so I went to emissions again today... this time I advanced my timing and drove around for like 20 minutes before I went to the emissions place. These are the numbers: HC 1.86 Fail - 1.60 CO 8.84 Pass - 15.00 NOX 3.89 Fail - 2.50 so as you can see i'm still failing 2/3 tests, but at least this time I passed the CO test WOOT!! I don't know where to go from here, this s*** is seriously so frustrating... can someone just fix my car and get it to pass then you can keep it. this is still using 1G Mas Edited March 25, 2009 by Low White N Boosted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edde Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 So it's rich and has high combustion temps. Get a stock MAS for $20, make sure the egr is working correctly and that the passages are clear. Put timing back to normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low White N Boosted Posted March 25, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 I'm gonna borrow a 1g MAS from Tubbs to try taking emissions with. As far as the EGR I bought a used one, but i was told it worked fine it looks new and I cleaned the tunnels when I rebuild my motor last year so I don't know why the EGR would have any problems.. How can I check to make sure the EGR is actually working? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikec Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 Have you fixed the bucking under boost yet? A common cause for that is running way-over-rich because the ECU's coolant temp sensor is shot. This is a separate temp sensor from the one that feeds your dash guage. When it fails, if often fails in the "engine is cold" reading - and when the engine is cold, the ECU tries to mimic a carb's choke function: extra rich. First, use the FAQ to see if your ECU is throwing any codes - if so, find out why and fix that problem. Then: on the intake manifold, near the oil dipstick, you'll see a 2-prong sensor with a squarish rubber boot on the wiring connector; the sensor itself points up/down. Make sure the wires to that sensor are good. Then drive around for 10 minutes or so to warm up the engine. Shut down, pull the connector off, and stick an ohmmeter on the 2 sensor prongs. You should see something a little below 300 ohms. If it's above 1000 ohms, either the sensor is shot or your coolant is quite cold (thermostat stuck open). As a test, go to Radio Shack or electronics parts store and buy a 220 to 270 ohm resistor. Hook that to the connector, in place of the sensor, and see if your bucking problem goes away. If it does, get a new sensor. And re-try the emissions... after you highway drive for a couple hours to burn out all the excess crap that's accumulated in your cat converter from running over-rich. It takes a HOT drive to clean it out, and a fair bit of time. THEN do the emissions test. mike c. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low White N Boosted Posted March 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 Well, I don't know what happened but that bucking problem just went away.. The only time it did it was when I was driving for about 45 minutes to an hour so the engine was hot when that was happening. I'll do the ECU code check and make sure nothing is going on there. The cat is brand new, i mean it's only got about MAYBE 100 miles on it do you think there would still be alot of build up? I know the car is running rich because I hooked up an a/f ratio guage and it's 2 bars above middle at WOT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low White N Boosted Posted March 30, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 30, 2009 put in a 1gMAS i picked up from Tubbs friday car seems to be running good, before the A/F ratio gauge read 2 green bars now it's down to 1 green bar so it helped a little with the running rich problem. I'm thinking before I go back to emissions I should try and find another stock downpipe with the extra cat and put that on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Low White N Boosted Posted April 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 after putting the 1g MAS on i still failed 2 / 3 tests except this time I failed CO and passed NOX hc - 1.82 / 1.60 co 18.3 / 15.00 nox - 1.90 / 2.50 i'm so sick of this s***, anybody wanna buy an 87tsi with 109k miles on it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie_Rich Posted April 22, 2009 Report Share Posted April 22, 2009 I'm not sure why you went and put another 1gmas on. You need to put a stock mas back on. Did you test the items mikec mentioned? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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