tokico illumina rear inserts....slight update pics/questions

[JustPaus_88TSi]

The coilover doesn't sit far enough down for that to work like that..

 

I don't know though, I don't think you'll see problems like with those MR2 kits that were welded on the bottoms, as the weld on the tops(in this idea) wouldn't have a tenth of the force applied on it.. Mainly just keeping the strut cartridge in the housing while the suspension is unloaded..

 

You've got maybe(this is a guess :wink: ) 3 or 4mm between the coilover sleeve and the strut..

[starion0352]

so in other word it will work fine i think?

right now i am waiting for my spacers to do the complete illumina rear set.

[Shisho]

Would it be possible to mount an MR2 rear monotube coilover from Tien, etc. instead of a Tokico shock and spring setup?

[starion0352]

Would it be possible to mount an MR2 rear monotube coilover from Tien, etc. instead of a Tokico shock and spring setup?

 

no because the upper and lower mr2 shock asembly mounts are different.

do you mean just coilovers or a whole rear mr2 assembly?

 

either way it wont mount right up......

[starion0352]

my progress so far...

purchased the Tokico Illuminas and got a pair of hacked open rear SHP's and cut open no SHP's for testing.

At first my idea was to hack open a pair of SHP rears,drop in a spacer(i have a 1 foot section of aluminum spacer material now also) and the illumina cartridge,,and put the SHP nut back on and run it.problem with that is now my shock housing has a big hole it.

 

so next my idea was was to use a cut open non SHP(you have to cut the top off its not threaded like SHP) then it wouldn't have to be welded shut but....i would have to thread it to accept the nut. to do that i need a large tap 47 mm i think. local macine shops dont have it and it cost about $180.00 to buy one.

 

i want to get the tap,cut the stock housing down,tap it and go....but that problem i am wondering about that is how much shorter my assembly will be and if that will cuase more preload on the rear springs?

 

measuring from bottom of housing to end of shaft(see link pics)

the insert with spacer is about 23 3/4" long

the insert in a cut housig no spacer is 22" long

 

so my questions are....

1)what is the stock effective length of the rear?(from bottom to shaft before threads start)

2) is more preload on the rear going to raise my car?(obviously with coilovers it wont matter but i have eibachs and i wanna this to be stock compatible too)

[Casey_L]

You could cut the threads on a lathe, any real machine shop should know how to do it. In fact, I could do it in my basement ;D

[lonestarion]

have it tig welded, minimum tensil strength of a tig weld is around 80,000psi. no way any suspension on any car street driven will develop that amount even in torsional strength. so if you are going to use coil overs i wouldnt worry about having a weak spot.

just make sure a reputable welder does the welding, and you have nothing to worry about.

[starion0352]

You could cut the threads on a lathe, any real machine shop should know how to do it. In fact, I could do it in my basement ;D

 

i can send em to you how much you charge me?

[starion0352]

have it tig welded, minimum tensil strength of a tig weld is around 80,000psi. no way any suspension on any car street driven will develop that amount even in torsional strength. so if you are going to use coil overs i wouldnt worry about having a weak spot.

just make sure a reputable welder does the welding, and you have nothing to worry about.

 

you mean the hole in the shp shock? i wasnt worried about strength just concerned about how shortening the total length is going to make the spring a little more compressed......

[starion0352]

here the link to picture

mocked up a non shp on left and shp on right with illumina cartridge

http://www.26liter.us/gallery/displayimage...cat=0&pos=5

[Casey_L]

I would do it for free. however it may be hard to position it centrally in the lathe. Send me pictures and I will see if I can do it or not.

 

Oh yeah, you also have to write up detailed instructions so that I can do this mod as well. I don't want GR-2's!

 

Post up the pics on imageshack or e-mail me at caseylacourse@gmail.com

[Casey_L]

On a second thought I really want to get into making one of these, and I really want to use my new lathe.

 

I am thinking of buying a single illumina rear shock and seeing what I can do. It might be easier, for me, to turn a brand new custom strut on the lathe using some high strength dom tubing, then welding everything together. Starion, do you think you could bring me up to speed on this project so I could help you. In return I will cut your threads and do some lathe work for you. Thanks

[starion0352]

On a second thought I really want to get into making one of these, and I really want to use my new lathe.

 

I am thinking of buying a single illumina rear shock and seeing what I can do. It might be easier, for me, to turn a brand new custom strut on the lathe using some high strength dom tubing, then welding everything together. Starion, do you think you could bring me up to speed on this project so I could help you. In return I will cut your threads and do some lathe work for you. Thanks

 

 

ya absolutely....i think the DOM might have some issues like Art's AGX ones breaking.

i will get some pics of what you need to do and email you.

[Casey_L]

On a second thought I really want to get into making one of these, and I really want to use my new lathe.

 

I am thinking of buying a single illumina rear shock and seeing what I can do. It might be easier, for me, to turn a brand new custom strut on the lathe using some high strength dom tubing, then welding everything together. Starion, do you think you could bring me up to speed on this project so I could help you. In return I will cut your threads and do some lathe work for you. Thanks

 

 

ya absolutely....i think the DOM might have some issues like Art's AGX ones breaking.

i will get some pics of what you need to do and email you.

 

Well, I think art's were failing due to a rust issue, and I could powdercoat them in and out to try and prevent it.

 

Like I said I am really interested in this and I am going to try and see what I can do because I have access to all these tools and I never use them.

 

I think I am going to try and model one up in solidworks.

[starion0352]

Arts broke cuz of rust? i did not know that. some of the pics i saw didnt appear to have rust.

hey that remimds me a guy has a pair of Art's rears for sale on here.he wants $180.00 for em though,and Art said i shouldn't use em.

 

i am concerned about how making the assembly shorter is going to preload the spring more. Casey you dont have a spare unopen rear shock setting around to measure do you? i want to see how much difference there is.

[Casey_L]

I had a spare unopened shock but I had to haul my parts car out to the crusher on Sunday! If I would have known about this project I would have grabbed it off. I am thinking about buying some GR-2's because they are cheap, and installing them with my Eibach Springs. Then working on the project in my spare time.

 

I just figured it would be easier to make a new shock body, and then machining a steel retainer for a coil over system. Do you have the outer diameter of the strut cartridge? This doesn't like too big of a project to me. I hope I can trust my welding.

[lonestarion]

stop wasting time & read this link, this is soon to happen

 

 

http://forums.austarion.com/viewtopic.php?t=6815

[Mingo1]

Well something needs to happen cause I really need some stiffer struts.

[starion0352]

stop wasting time & read this link, this is soon to happen

 

 

http://forums.austarion.com/viewtopic.php?t=6815

 

 

you gotta be kidding me. stop wasting time? i've read that thread on austarion......it has no details. and its for the fronts,i am talking about the rears here.

right now we can already use three different front inserts fairly easily.

1)tokico HP

2)kyb with spacer

3)illumina with spacer

 

and i dont think removing the spindle from a front strut housing is as easy as cutting a weld.

 

and is that thread started by a member named bdperformance?? hahaha

is this the same bdperformance that was on *DM's site ofering carbon fiber hoods and lightweight plastic a/c brackets? :roll:

[Casey_L]

Yeah that BD Performance guy is bogus. He has been lurking around *DM's for like three years saying that he is going to be making something, but he has never even seen anything. The only vendor I could see pursuing this is the Mookeh guy.

 

Ok, so here is my game plan, please everyone that is reading this comment on it to make sure I am not missing something. We basically need a redesigned version of art's strut housing. His design used a thin walled HREW tubing that failed because of a couple of reasons. The first was corrosion and rust. That can be fixed with powder coating. I already have an oven hooked up in the basement so all I need is the gun and a little practice. So that is covered.

 

The second was the weld. It may not have been the best. I am not a very good welder but I think I could weld up a safe prototype for my use and if anyone else wanted one I might be able to get this professionally welded.

 

The second was the fact that it may have been under engineered. I am planning on OVER engineering my design so that I know that it wont fail.

 

Now for the actual design.

 

I plan on using a very thick walled DOM tubing (The kind that is used in roll cadges, etc.) Very strong, usually very circular so it will be good on the lathe. I plan on using something around the .120" wall size.

 

Then, the inner diameter of the strut body must be large enough for the illumina insert to go into. I can always drill centrally with the lathe to make sure I get it just large enough for it to slip in.

 

The outer diameter must be small enough for it to fit in the the lower arm of the suspension.

 

Then a bracket must be machined then welded to the shock body in order for it to be bolted securely into the suspension arm.

 

A spacer or an insert could me machined from a solid rod of steel then welded to the base of the strut housing to accommodate the smaller length of the illumina shock. This will have an approximate hight of 2 inches or so.

 

Then, threads must be cut on the inner diameter of the strut body in order for a cap to be screwed into the strut to insure that the illumina shock does not come out. I can do this with my lathe, I just recently bought the right gears to cut threads and I am eager to do it. :twisted:

 

 

Finally threads for the coil over height adjustment nut must be threaded into the outside body. I think this might be an easier way to do it, it would make the whole design one piece. However, since the body would be made from rust it may have to be constantly greased so that it does not freeze to the strut body.

 

Am I missing anything? Surely the actual design and engineering of the new strut body will start when I actually have one off the car so I can look at it and make sure everything works, but am I missing anything in my game plan?

[starion0352]

Casey sounds good but why the need for a bracket on the stock arm?

why not use the clamp set up we already have?

 

i think the best and most end user friendly thing to do is

a kit type thing done on a stock core.....

1)cut down stock housing

2)thread stock housing to accept nut

provide the nut and spacer for illumina or agx

 

this would yeild a rear shock that could go back installed on a stock car easy bolt in.

 

options you could offer

1)cut down stock spring perch for coilovers

2)paint /powder coat

[lonestarion]

good you guys do all that work ill let tein make mine...........

[starion0352]

good you guys do all that work ill let tein make mine...........

 

 

good . maybe you can show us some installed pics after you blow $1700 on these supposed kits.

 

this thing in my thread here is something that is aimed at the starquest community that most guys could possibly do as a upgrade to their car using commonly available and proven to work mr2 inserts.

 

i hope this tien thing really goes somewhere if it does i will be you #1 fan but right now i am not.

 

oh and on a side note you may want to update your signature on the *DM site it says "future producer of starquest aftermarket parts that were never made but should have" that is interesting becuase you say you dont have time and you are going to have tien do it for you.

[Casey_L]

I didn't even think that the bracket was not welded on in the first place. This makes the whole thing really easy. So easy I am dumbfounded. get some picks of those struts man!

[starion0352]

I didn't even think that the bracket was not welded on in the first place. This makes the whole thing really easy. So easy I am dumbfounded. get some picks of those struts man!

 

will do.