Some Cars Should Never Be Offered With Auto Trannies!!!!!

[verde2002]

I might be old school but I hate seeing a great looking sports car only to find out it has an auto tranny upon closer inspection. A Porsche 911 turbo with an auto???? Give me a break. It is so senseless. Why build a great car and handicap it with an auto? If you don't want to put in the effort to get what a proper sports car has to offer then go buy a Buick and cruise that along. The excuse that it is annoying in traffic to drive a manual is just that, an excuse. I live in LA, we have the worst traffic and I have no issues with driving a manual. The only automatics I can remotely tolerate are the BMW SMG type or Ferrari F1 type transmissions that are in essence manual minus the clutch pedal. To be very blunt and honest I don't think the Starion should have ever been offered in auto. If you want to enjoy a sports car properly take the time to learn how to drive a manual car and enjoy it the right way.

[IntercooledFlatty]

so what does one do if he only has a right leg ?

 

i love the auto quest, especially for drag racing, and i can shift a standard with just a right leg, it's just not as fast some, but faster than others cause a ninja rolls like that, BUT an auto is nice for crusing. manually shifting an auto is ok too as you have some control of where you want to be.

[Cloud81918]

Not a fan of Autos here. I'd never buy an auto sportscar. It can be ok with them in family cars, but still would rather not have one. Currenty we own 2 and I always wonder when they'll break. I can service a manual, I can change a clutch. But breaking down an automatic is out of my expertise and It don't really enjoy driving them either.

 

But I think DSGs will probably take nearly everything over in the future. A lot of pople think they mean the end of the manual, but I think they really are the end of the Auto. I see the manual holding on for quite a while because of running costs. But I think we are seeing the last days of development in automatic and manual transmissions.

 

I do think when looking at a sportscar one needs to ask why they want one.

 

If you don't want to be bothered with shifting, perhaps you don't really want a sportscar for the right reasons. If you don't want to be involved, then you have your eyes on the wrong type of car. Perhaps you' be better served by a luxury sports coupe, something like a BMW 330. I run into people all the time that own a [whatever] and complained that something was too tight, too thristy, didn't have enough truck room, etc. They'd complain about their ownership over something that that car never promised to deliver. Sportscars should be fun and should be involving. Even if they aren't fast they should keep you a wake and at time a bit uncomfortable. People who don't understand that ruin th sports car market by forcing manufactures to make them with automatic transmissions.

 

If you want one for fun manual is the obvious choice.

 

If you want one for racing, well then maybe a DSG style or an automatic (depending on the type of racing) is the way to go. But that choice is made with a focus on the type of racing at hand and if you aren't racing with milliseconds counting buy a stick.

[Cloud81918]

so what does one do if he only has a right leg ?

 

i love the auto quest, especially for drag racing, and i can shift a standard with just a right leg, it's just not as fast some, but faster than others cause a ninja rolls like that, BUT an auto is nice for crusing. manually shifting an auto is ok too as you have some control of where you want to be.

 

 

^Great point, I give a big exception there. I do know a guy that lost a leg and drove a automatic Eclipse GS-T. But barring a physical issue though sportscars should be manual for enjoyments sake.

Edited February 28, 2013 by Cloud81918

[verde2002]

so what does one do if he only has a right leg ?

 

i love the auto quest, especially for drag racing, and i can shift a standard with just a right leg, it's just not as fast some, but faster than others cause a ninja rolls like that, BUT an auto is nice for crusing. manually shifting an auto is ok too as you have some control of where you want to be.

 

There ar always exceptions to the rule but as a general thought I still feel the way I feel.

[Burton]

I prefer manuals in most sports cars too, especially 4 and 6 cylinder cars, but I see nothing wrong with having a few autos. Most true sports cars only offer a small percentage of autos, if any at all, so why be mad that maybe 10% of them are autos? Some people don't know how to drive manuals, and have no desire to learn. Other's want the ease of cruising around in the auto. Remember, not everyone buys a sports car to go racing. They're a status symbol for many people.

 

Some people want them... people who have money. Manufacturers would be stupid to not provide what their customers want. A small percentage of their customers want autos, so they do it. The good thing for guys like you is that if they want one of those kinds of cars, the majority of them were made with manuals, so when you buy one for yourself, you can have exactly what you want fairly easily. I see no reason someone who prefers autos should be kept from owning a car they want, just because "most" of the people that buy them want manuals.

 

Myself, I want a 68-77 "Vette, but I want it to get it to make it look awesome and then just cruise it. I don't want to hot rod it around or anything like that. Because of that, I intend on getting one with an auto. That would suck if I couldn't have an auto, just because some people think they shouldn't exist in performance cars.

 

 

We should be glad we have choices. If auto makers only made what "most" people want, we wouldn't even have sports cars. Auto makers would only offer full size trucks, and mid size 4 door sedans.

Edited February 28, 2013 by Burton

[jszucs]

I might be old school but I hate seeing a great looking sports car only to find out it has an auto tranny upon closer inspection. A Porsche 911 turbo with an auto???? Give me a break. It is so senseless. Why build a great car and handicap it with an auto? If you don't want to put in the effort to get what a proper sports car has to offer then go buy a Buick and cruise that along. The excuse that it is annoying in traffic to drive a manual is just that, an excuse. I live in LA, we have the worst traffic and I have no issues with driving a manual. The only automatics I can remotely tolerate are the BMW SMG type or Ferrari F1 type transmissions that are in essence manual minus the clutch pedal. To be very blunt and honest I don't think the Starion should have ever been offered in auto. If you want to enjoy a sports car properly take the time to learn how to drive a manual car and enjoy it the right way.

 

 

How is an auto handycaping a sports car?

 

You better go do some research. An auto will be able to be made stronger then a manual, and auto now shifts WAY faster then a manual even VS the very best driver in the world driving the manual. An auto will be able to hold boost while shifting. So I'm failing to see how improving performace is handcaping a car.

 

Maybe feeling conected to what is going on with the car is not someone's idea of enjoying there sports car? Maybe there idea is driving the car to the max performace is there idea.

 

Autos now also yeald better MPG, don't fail and require maintance as often as older one's. What about applicaitons where a manual change is just to slow for the cars performance level?

 

Heck I'm in the process of finding a new driver car (all be it, I'm not looking for a sports car), and one thing I really want is a 6 speed auto. I can paddle shift it when driving it spirited, and put it in drive in rush hour to and from work. + being a 6 speed I get great MPG out of it.

Edited February 28, 2013 by jszucs

[verde2002]

Burton, I will have to disagree that only 10% or so are auto. I don't have the exact figures but I wouldn't be surprised if 30 to 40 percent of the US market Porsches sold are auto. The M5 a few years ago was introduced in Auto only until they introduced the manual a year later. Another tragic example is the new Lancer Evolution X. The top of the line MR model ( Mitsubishi Racing) is only offered in manustick and not a proper manual.

 

This is a US only phenomenon. If iot wasn't for the US demand of automatic sports cars I don't think most companies would manufacture them. And here we wonder why the rest of the world sees us as fat and lazy.

[verde2002]

How is an auto handycaping a sports car?

 

You better go do some research. An auto will be able to be made stronger then a manual, and auto now shifts WAY faster then a manual even VS the very best driver in the world driving the manual. An auto will be able to hold boost while shifting. So I'm failing to see how improving performace is handcaping a car.

 

Maybe feeling conected to what is going on with the car is not someone's idea of enjoying there sports car? Maybe there idea is driving the car to the max performace is there idea.

 

Autos now also yeald better MPG, don't fail and require maintance as often as older one's. What about applicaitons where a manual change is just to slow for the cars performance level?

 

An auto has never or will ever shift faster than a manual transmission car. Auto meaning with a torque converter. I think you are reffering to the SMG type transmissions that actually have a clutch and not a torque converter except the clutch is depressed by a computer rather than a clutch pedal.

 

We are discussing street driven cars. I hope you do not bring up the point of a top fuel dragster or a funny car to prove your point of an auto shifting faster.

Edited February 28, 2013 by verde2002

[jszucs]

An auto has never or will ever shift faster than a manual transmission car. Auto meaning with a torque converter. I think you are reffering to the SMG type transmissions that actually have a clutch and not a torque converter except the clutch is depressed by a computer rather than a clutch pedal.

 

We are discussing street driven cars. I hope you do not bring up the point of a top fuel dragster or a funny car to prove your point of an auto shifting faster.

 

No non duel clutch autos made for performace shift faster then manuals now. Don't be bitter Tec can beat you.

[verde2002]

No non duel clutch autos made for performace shift faster then manuals now. Don't be bitter Tec can beat you.

 

Never bitter, always positive.

[verde2002]

I think people might be missing my point. You should be in complete control of a sports car and feel as one with the car. I feel an auto takes that experience away from it. Auto is easier and takes less effort, I agree but softer suspension is more comfortable and higher profile tires have less road noise, with this logic we lose the true meaning of what a sports car is. You want to feel as one with the car and things being done automatically for you by the car take that experience away.

[jszucs]

I think people might be missing my point. You should be in complete control of a sports car and feel as one with the car. I feel an auto takes that experience away from it. Auto is easier and takes less effort, I agree but softer suspension is more comfortable and higher profile tires have less road noise, with this logic we lose the true meaning of what a sports car is. You want to feel as one with the car and things being done automatically for you by the car take that experience away.

 

Then why don't you click buttons to ignight your spark plugs? Just because the car is shifting for you does not mean you are disconected. You could be totally engaged, and a very compitant driver and still drive an auto.

 

I agree with you the majoroity of people have got very lazy with there driving habbits. And most are oblivious to what's going on around them (cars have been made to be to encapcilating)

 

 

You must really hate the new BMW crotch rocket then?????? You can crack the throttel wide open, dump the clutch and launch traction and stablity contorl will have you ride off doing the perfect wheely at the balance point for MAX accell possible from the bike.

[Burton]

OK, even if 40% are autos.... Have you ever not been able to find a manual in the type of sportscar you wanted? Supply and demand... The auto companies make enough of what they can sell. and making money on 40% of the market is way better than only the 10% I thought. All the more proof, that more people want autos in their sports cars.

 

 

Also, were you aware that the auto SQ had a faster 1/4 time than the manual SQ when new? I can't remember which mags they were, but if you go back and look at the tests on the SQs in the car mags back when they were new, the auto cars seemed to be a little quicker. My father confirmed this for me when he had an auto loaner while his Starion was in the shop. He said the auto seemed "substantially" faster than his manual.

 

 

This isn't Soviet Russia. Americans want and have choices, one of the great things about this country. It's very selfish of you to think that all sports cars should be manuals, just because that's what YOU like.

[jszucs]

^ the SQ auto having the advantage is in the gearing, and that you do not lift to shift so the throttel plate stays open and the compressor dose not slow down or stall.

 

O and yes I have been able to not find a manual GMC Typhoon..... and yes I know you want to call it an SUV not a sports car, but it will beat a 911 of the same vintage up to 80MPH when launced hard.

Edited February 28, 2013 by jszucs

[verde2002]

I do think a proper sports car should be manual just as a proper suit should me made of wool and a proper engagement ring should have a real diamond in it. If I suggest a proper sports car should have lower profile tires will everyone agree or will people suggest higher profile tires are better because they have a softer ride? There is no absolute for anything but time and experience has taught us some things are better a certain way.

[verde2002]

Burton,

 

Yes, I was looking to purchase the newest gereration Lancer Evolution MR before its debut but when I found out it was an autostick I purchased the previous generation MR which had a proper 6-speed manual transmission. Many had the same complaint when the last generation BMW M5 was introduced until a year or two later BMW decided to offer the manual variant.

[jszucs]

Burton,

 

Yes, I was looking to purchase the newest gereration Lancer Evolution MR before its debut but when I found out it was an autostick I purchased the previous generation MR which had a proper 6-speed manual transmission. Many had the same complaint when the last generation BMW M5 was introduced until a year or two later BMW decided to offer the manual variant.

 

The LANCER IS 4 DOORS SO IT's NOT A SPORTS CAR!

[verde2002]

The LANCER IS 4 DOORS SO IT's NOT A SPORTS CAR!

 

LMAO. Good one.

[jszucs]

Thanks I though so.... So how much do you love that baby? They are really nice, but every time I look at one I sware I want a RHD one.

[Burton]

See, but what's "better" is all a matter of perception. Some people think auto sports cars are better.

 

 

More people like McDonald's over Burger King, so should we close all Burger Kings? What about Wendy's? They're barely in the spectrum of the burger wars.

 

What if after the wars of the mid-late 1900's, the pro US sentiment had held strong and foreign cars were never sold here? Your only choices for serious sports cars would be the Vette, Viper and Ford GT. Of course, there's Camaros, Mustangs, and Challengers, but are those even real sports cars?

[verde2002]

Thanks I though so.... So how much do you love that baby? They are really nice, but every time I look at one I sware I want a RHD one.

 

Love the car, I am on my 3rd EVO already. The only other car I have owned that I felt was more of a drivers car was my Honda S2000. Underpowered but the handeling and road feedback was amazing. It's kind of ironic I feel this way since I hate convertibles.

 

A RHD Evo would be sweet, especially the FQ400 they offered in England.

[Burton]

Burton,

 

Yes, I was looking to purchase the newest gereration Lancer Evolution MR before its debut but when I found out it was an autostick I purchased the previous generation MR which had a proper 6-speed manual transmission. Many had the same complaint when the last generation BMW M5 was introduced until a year or two later BMW decided to offer the manual variant.

 

See, supply and demand at it's finest... Enough people wanted the true manual and they made it.

 

 

I'm sure if Mitsubishi sees enough demand to offer a manual in the EVO and have it still be profitable, they will.

[verde2002]

See, but what's "better" is all a matter of perception. Some people think auto sports cars are better.

 

 

More people like McDonald's over Burger King, so should we close all Burger Kings? What about Wendy's? They're barely in the spectrum of the burger wars.

 

What if after the wars of the mid-late 1900's, the pro US sentiment had held strong and foreign cars were never sold here? Your only choices for serious sports cars would be the Vette, Viper and Ford GT. Of course, there's Camaros, Mustangs, and Challengers, but are those even real sports cars?

 

I don't disagree whit you at all. This is my opinion and what I feel is better. I opened up this conversation on this forum to get differing points of views and also some that agree with me. I guess I have a really strong opinion on sports cars being manual.

[jszucs]

It's a mixed bag for me..... If I were to buy a sports car, I would want the MAX performace offered, and would be willing to sacrafice, noise, ride, having anything but raw metal or composit inside. Just the raw esentials. Currently auto's are going to offer the max performace, so I would opt for it.

 

Most people whold HATE a car that rides so ruff you have to ware a mouth guard though.

 

If I were to buy a new EVO as a "toy" I would want a manual. If I would buy it for a daily (wouldn't because it's falling below MPG I can get with other choices) I would want it in auto/manual. If I would be buying it for max performace I would want it in auto manual.

 

I do agree with you a manual does make a connection for the car / driver but it's not mutually exclusive that auto = instant driver disconected. Ken bock drives an auto / manual in his race cars. Do you think he's disconected? It's a convenience for him, you don't have the work, the changes can be made faster with no misses, and he can devote his mind to everything else.

 

 

I think this actuly hits home with me more for the first time I got on an auto quad. It was a big polaris 4X4 quad with manual high 2 high 4 low 4, but the trans was auto. I was so freaked out the thing would make a gear change when I was hill climbing with it, I barely pushed it.

Edited February 28, 2013 by jszucs