johnfjamerson

Lets Recap. The HKS in my possession wont just bolt on and go. PERIOD. Hence; 100 copies would do nothing but make 100 copies that WONT WORK. Second---My goal is to inexpensively alter this head so that it will work on a car with a stock fuel system. The way this head is shaped requires custom parts. The front cam support (see pictures posted before) lies and is cast exactly where the cam gear would be on the stock head. ----SO, just putting it on with different gears WONT WORK either. I am not going to have some one knock out 100 copies of this unless i get ONE stinkin head working first. And since everyone and their mother seems to be criticizing the speed at which I do this... aint makin it go any faster. No one wants to see this more than I, no one is vested in this more than I, and so no one should be grumpy, about the fact that I am taking my sweet time. --- Let me also, note, that the people whom ARE financially involved have not asked once, not ONCE, "when is this going to be done".

Good Evening All. I can now explain what is going to happen next and why it must happen. First off, please note that the cam chain rides closer to the block. becasue of this, this HKS head will not directly bolt together. As with the Sakura head. An adapter will be used. This adapter will transfer the load of the timing chain from the crank to the cams. The step down will be done from the crank to the adapter (or intermediate --- such as a VR6 Volkswagon) and then a smaller gog will drive the cams, with identical gogs on them. Please see ilistration and pictures. http://www.geocities.com/johnfjamerson/block2.JPG Top View of Head http://www.geocities.com/johnfjamerson/block3.JPG From Undernieth http://www.geocities.com/johnfjamerson/block4.jpg Front http://www.geocities.com/johnfjamerson/BLOCK5.jpg The installation of this will REQUIER the use of a ballance shaft elimination kit, and the removal of the upper ballance shaft. Another benifit is the increase of oil flow that will now reach the larger head. The adapter will be made of steel with a steel shaft, and likewise steel gears. It will also requier machining of the front cover so that a support fom both sides of the shaft will be there. Similar to the idler shafts that will be used in the head. It will bolted to the block into existing holes that will be vaccant do to the absence of the stock guides. (Labled "A-F") This will be done on a core basis. I am working on a modle made of Bondo (yeah, dont laugh .... its cheaper than metal, easier to work with than metal and wood, and if i mess up, i can just add more a little at a time) meassurements can be taken off the piece and manufactured. Hope this will tide peple over for a wee bit. PS: Very sorry to hear that Ghost.

A honda with a chain?! Never thought it would happen. But i guess it makes sence, seeing as they are tring to extend the service life of their motors... I will head down to Honda tomorrow on my lunch break and take a look at what they have apart. As for using two stock gears... That ws the original idea, however, the two gears are rediculously big. The HKS head is not wide enough to fit them both. It could work, but im not sure that Chad would appriciate me cutting and welding on his head. Also, the space where the chain is fed up to the head is more forward than the stock gear. It is inline with the balance shaft chain instead of the normal cam chain on the sohc g54's. One possibility we are looking into as having a 'transmission' adapter plate that would bolt to the front of the block under the front cover that steps down the gear ratio so that smaller pullys may be used. For example: a stock crank timing gear in its normal position drives a shortened belt up to the transfer plate. This plate has a single shaft with a stock cam gear drivin by the afore mentioned chain. (This provides the step down requiered for the cam) The other end of the shaft, in line with the hole on the HKS uses one sproket driving a chain that goes to both cam gears. In this type of setup, all three gears can be exactly the same diameter since the step down was already accomplished at the 'transmission' plate. That means you can use sprockets the size of the stock crank sproket if you wanted to. You see a little about why this is taking so long. Belleive me when i say i wish (and i thought in the beginning) that it would not nearly take this long. But when i am going the cheap route and trying to save money by thoroughly investigating and ruling out different posibilitys. Want more info... Keep in mind this is only to get the HKS in my possetion to work on one car. Stock gears on HKS head: PROs -cheap gears -cheap chain -easy to intall? -stock disributor drive CONs -spacing incorrect (depth on drive is in balnce shaft position) -would requier a spacer bushing and ballance shaft elimination -no drive for oil pump unless routed with cams -HKS head is not wide enough to fit gears -cutting requiered Custom gears on HKS head: PROs -cheap chain -easy to install -no modification to HKS head -can work with stock distributor drive CONs -same problem with spacing as above -COST $$$, three totaly custom cut gears from sctratch=$1000 bucks -possible problem with gears such as workmanship or fit=second set of gears @ $1000 bucks Other OEM gears on HKS head: PROs -moderatly cheap chain -moderatly cheap gears -easy to source gears -no or little modification to HKS head CONs -Same spacing problem as above -may not work with stock distributor drive -best guess on which parts fit (trial and error) -takes time to explore different options such as manufacturer and engine series Transmission assembly: PROs -cheap chains (bottom and top) -cheap bottom end gears (stock) -fixes spacing problem -no modification to HKS head -use standard gears for top end (like SB chev crank gears [$7.65ea]) CONs -extra custom parts -heavier driving assembly -more noise (two chains) -costlier As you can see i think about everything. I look at everything, and i play with everything. I havent stoped with this, and i appriciate that everyone is now just talking instead of accusing as before. I cant just make any of you change your mind, but at least it seems that [some] of you are being more open to the idea. Again, thank you. As for pictures, If you wan some, I can take some closeups of the head on a block. as for parts, there are none to take pictures of since the one i had fabricated (or started to fabricate anyway... it was a chain guide) will not work at all. Some work was done earlier this year on some adapters, but the same was realized when the spacing was off. Untill I narow down and eliminate all posibillities except for one, no machine work will restart. Ill get into my personal life a bit so you can see what time i do actualy have for this. I work 45-50 hours a week managing a car parts store. I have a 7 month old boy and i am getting married in 5 weeks. I care for my girlfreinds car when it breaks as well as two of my sisters and my parents two cars. When i am lucky i get two full days off a week to spend with my family. Some weeks both days go to this project, and some weeks i dont have any time at all. I am sure everyone realizes that I am a lot cheaper than a shop trying to research what may work best. every once in a while I will go and ask them what they think of this or that, and when i have a new idea i go and buy them lunch and talk it over with them. Also dont forget that i have a guy in porte rico that is getitng detailed measurments and pictures of a working assembly. I thought they were gonna be a little sooner but I am not impatient. I wait eagerly however. Again thank you for your support and ideas (esspesialy that honda one) I check them all out as they come about, and i have the time. Have a good weekend.

Im working with a late 70's mercedes timing setup right now, trying this and that. still working on alot of stuff.... I think Chad lost the matching valve cover... i need that . ummm and oh yeah, Sakura is getting detailed specs and tons of pics of the only other complete head (that i know of) in the world. I offered to buy or even 'rent' the head but they said no. so i am also waiting patiently for the free pictures. I would fly there my self and get some but id have to conect two flights and stay in the air for like 15 hours each way and id get there just in time for them to close. ...... bummer.

okay, mine wernt banjo either. I was only wondering what material you were using becasue i didnt pay that much for my stuff and it did the same thing. And the -8 i mentioned was for my turbo oil feed lines, not the cooler lines

Im not saying there is anything wrong with that... but this shop is very near me and does all of my lines. They did my SS braided brake lines for my isuzu for $140, and both oil lines for the turbo )-an8) for $60. They also made a fuel line for my rail for $30, but that was only 8 inchs long. They do nylon as well as the higher quality rubber, and fiberglass inpregnated lines for oil, fuel, water and whatever else. The oil lines they made were fiberglass inpregnated rubber, and were crimped with the angled AN fittings on them already.

Isnt that kinda high? How much of that is the fittings? I know if you go with Earls thats alota $$$. I had some cooler lines made for my Starion just after i broke in my rebuilt motor, and they were a one-shot set for $90 including fittings. ---good to 48,000psi. What kind of line are you using?

A big thanks to kev_rm for the shortblock. It will help greatly!!!

yes, fraid so. the stock cames dont have enough lobes, and the main journals are just way to big. no other car has a bore center to center like this. close but not close enough.

There will not be rockers. This will not resemble the 4g63 lifter setup. It will have a diract acting camshaft, such as the mazda head in this picture. I will more than likely use toyota parts, since they are everywhere, and performance upgrades (that i will be using anyway) are readily availible. For that matter if anyone has to replace parts, or wants to tweek anything then they can just go get toyota parts. ---Thinking of either the 2jz parts, or more likely, the 3sgte parts. To do a regrind on this setup, you must reshim the lifters, which are mechanical, with larger (thicker) shims to offset the distance between the base circle of the cam, and the bucket assembly of the lifter. This gkind of regrind only requiers a grind down of the base circle and no spray welding is needed. so it actually costs less to make new cam profiles out of your exsisting cams. anyway heres a pic. http://www.geocities.com/nwmeet03/head/DCP03132.JPG

I just may need that smog.... can you pm your number to me and ill call you sunday night if i need it. thanks

Does anybody have a spare block that is in the seattle area? Just needs to have a crank, running or not. (but does need to spin). I want the shop to start work on the timing chain and sprokets while I figure out what parts for the valves i will use. (lifter bucket setup... most likely going to be toyota, or possibly isuzu) I also have to figure the weight of the valves to have springs made, or see if anyone has an off the shelf part. Yeah, anyway.... I can pick up a block in the Seattle area on monday 6/13 if anyone can help.

The girdles and mock-up cams are being made. Damn im so busy i cant get much time to get up to the shop and see what they are doing. We thought we were gonna use the stock cams as mock-ups untill some real ones were made... but the journals on them are just too big, so we either have to cut them down, or just make a mockup out of a strait piece of bar stock. Its not going as fast as I would like, but were going from sctrach on the cam setup basicly.

thats what we were hoping

We are working on the cam cradle at the moment. It is hard trying to decide how what hieght to make everything, and what cam journal diameter to use, since we have none to refference at the moment. I am contacting Sakura about their head, to see if they would be willing to sell just the head, (cuz the engine is like 7K) or at least take some measurements of the stuff that is there. That way we dont have to reinvent so much. The DOHC setup did not use guides. instead used two idler gears like so... http://www.geocities.com/johnfjamerson/head/route.jpg Less parts, less ware, less money. And no modification to the timing cover. Everytime i head up to the shop i forget my camera, so ill put it in the car now, and then ill have it next week.