Rebuilding an 87

[Gunnarson]

Currently putting back together this puzzle after the owner I bought it from, rebuilt the engine and took basically the whole car apart.

It's been slow, finding and affording parts and the time for all of it, but so far here's a few things I know for a fact I need to replace or put back in

- New clutch, flywheel, and pressure plate (I've got a lightweight flywheel the owner gave me.) Any recommendations for a clutch? I was given a clutch out of an 88 because the bolt patterns I'm working with for this are for an 88, but I don't think I want to put an old OEM clutch in if I can afford a new clutch

- Needs a wiring harness for just about the entire car, I also got an 88 ECU and engine harness, (not entirely sure how much of the interior harness I need) instead of an 87, planning on going standalone. I was thinking maybe a megasquirt, any alternatives you'd recommend over the megasquirt? I'm familiar with Haltech but don't know anything past the name.

- Previous owner said I'll need injectors and to "slightly modify the magna multiport manifold" I honestly forgot most of what he was telling me about with the modification and I'm not entirely sure what the magna multiport manifold is, any help would be greatly appreciated. I have a part that I believe to be the fuel injector system? Has ECI Multi across it, not a 100% on what it is, I'm still learning!

- Need to repair the cracked exhaust manifold or get a new one. I'm considering trying to repair it because he mentioned that it was modified and custom made to fit. The flange at the top of the exhaust manifold was modified to accept the TD05 16G compressor. Being honest, I don't know what this means, this is my first turbo car.

 

Any recommendations for parts or things I should look out for or look to replace regardless would be greatly appreciated. Along with any help or info you might know I'd love to learn a bit more. If you want pictures, I'd be happy to give to you what I've got on hand I just can't upload them here due to file size limit

 

 

[kev]

Yeah, pictures would help of its current condition...specifically of the engine compartment and areas of missing parts.   

Post some pictures of the Magna.  If it hasn't been mod'd at all, it will need a bunch of modifications to make it ready for install.   There is a different coolant passage near the rear of the head that needs to be amended unless the car has a Magna head.   The thermostat hosing needs to be relocated to the front of the manifold.  Need to add ports for the vac booster and the heater core line.  Last would be to modify the input flange to accept a larger throttle body...typically we use ford 65mm throttle bodies off of a 5.0 or 4.6.    Minor items needed would be a bracket for a throttle cable and vacuum ports.   

As for the clutch...there are some options depending on your goals.  A common clutch is ACT, although i'd avoid the extreme p/pl, it makes the clutch hard to depress.  The heavy duty p/pl would be a better option.    There may be newer clutch alternatives that others can suggest.  

Your engine management will dictate the injectors you will need.   The Magnas typically take a GM style injector but the EMS will determine if they need to be high impedance or low impedance and the flow rate.  

I'll let others chime in on the EMS.  There again are many options.  Megasquirt is probably the most common and you could get the most support from people on here (and facebook).   I personally run SDS, it is a very simple system and can be frustrating but it serves the purpose for me.    I think MotoCam360 is selling a very affordable EMS now, from what I just read recently on facebook.   

These forums are a good source of technical info but unfortunately most members scrammed after this last database issue and went to facebook.   I'm not a facebook fan but I do lurk the starquest groups there...you will see a lot more 'activity' there.  

Hope this helps.  

kev

[kev]

Oh for the harnesses, you will need every harness from the original car except portions of the engine harness that runs through the passenger side.    There are a few differences between 87 and 88 'main' harnesses (not the engine harness).  The big one is the thermostat on the heater core.   

You will need a few wires from the engine harness for the MPI swap, this being the starter wire and a few wires for your stock gauges in the cluster if you are maintaining them.    It won't matter if it is an 87 vs 88 engine harness for doing an MPI swap.   You only retain a couple wires and really the only difference is the knock box which you won't be using.  

kev

[BKB94]

B38 connector is your friend if you have it.  We need pictures
 

https://projectzerog.com/wiring-how_to.shtml

Edited February 14, 2023 by BKB94

[Gunnarson]

On 2/14/2023 at 7:00 AM, kev said:

Yeah, pictures would help of its current condition...specifically of the engine compartment and areas of missing parts.   

Post some pictures of the Magna.  If it hasn't been mod'd at all, it will need a bunch of modifications to make it ready for install.   There is a different coolant passage near the rear of the head that needs to be amended unless the car has a Magna head.   The thermostat hosing needs to be relocated to the front of the manifold.  Need to add ports for the vac booster and the heater core line.  Last would be to modify the input flange to accept a larger throttle body...typically we use ford 65mm throttle bodies off of a 5.0 or 4.6.    Minor items needed would be a bracket for a throttle cable and vacuum ports.   

As for the clutch...there are some options depending on your goals.  A common clutch is ACT, although i'd avoid the extreme p/pl, it makes the clutch hard to depress.  The heavy duty p/pl would be a better option.    There may be newer clutch alternatives that others can suggest.  

Your engine management will dictate the injectors you will need.   The Magnas typically take a GM style injector but the EMS will determine if they need to be high impedance or low impedance and the flow rate.  

I'll let others chime in on the EMS.  There again are many options.  Megasquirt is probably the most common and you could get the most support from people on here (and facebook).   I personally run SDS, it is a very simple system and can be frustrating but it serves the purpose for me.    I think MotoCam360 is selling a very affordable EMS now, from what I just read recently on facebook.   

These forums are a good source of technical info but unfortunately most members scrammed after this last database issue and went to facebook.   I'm not a facebook fan but I do lurk the starquest groups there...you will see a lot more 'activity' there.  

Hope this helps.  

kev

Hey Kev, sorry for the long delay on this. I just got back from basic not too long ago, so I just went recently and got pictures https://imgur.com/a/3SjHlJl here's all of the good pictures I've got. I know I need some tubing for the radiator and to hookup the exhaust again, but I'm still fixing up the exhaust manifold and turbo before I do that.

[Gunnarson]

On 2/14/2023 at 8:32 AM, BKB94 said:

B38 connector is your friend if you have it.  We need pictures
 

https://projectzerog.com/wiring-how_to.shtml

https://imgur.com/a/3SjHlJl here's some pictures! Sorry for the delay, I recently got out of basic.

[kev]

Yeah, definitely missing a few pieces there but your post seems to indicate you have a lot of it.   The entire intake and exhaust side of course, the radiator, slop tank, fans, alternator, downpipe, air cleaner, coil, etc.   I see the main fuel line plus fuel filter and bracket there next to the steering box but the fuel line from the filter to the intake is gone.  Not really a big deal if you go MPI, because you will need to make up a new line anyways.   Power steering pump is gone but the reservoir is still there.   Oil cooler is still there and I can see braided lines but it isn't connected to the engine at the moment (do your have the banjo bolts?).   Air conditioner is gone, which is common, but you will need an alternator bracket for a AC delete.   There is no difference in the exhaust manifold for a TD05 16G.  The turbine housing may have been ported for that turbo though but the manifold itself is the same.  That's a good turbo for these cars btw.  It will have quick spool-up and be reliable.  If you continue down the MPI route, it will give you the biggest increase in performance.   MPI is frustrating because of the fabricating involved but it is the best mod to the G54B.   As much as I love these cars, I hate the stock EMS and injector setup.   

It's not a bad starting point if the car is rust free.  Everything can be sourced.  I love that it is an atlantic blue car.   

[kev]

Oh, it is a conquest btw, not a starion.  

[Gunnarson]

On 4/24/2023 at 8:34 AM, kev said:

Yeah, definitely missing a few pieces there but your post seems to indicate you have a lot of it.   The entire intake and exhaust side of course, the radiator, slop tank, fans, alternator, downpipe, air cleaner, coil, etc.   I see the main fuel line plus fuel filter and bracket there next to the steering box but the fuel line from the filter to the intake is gone.  Not really a big deal if you go MPI, because you will need to make up a new line anyways.   Power steering pump is gone but the reservoir is still there.   Oil cooler is still there and I can see braided lines but it isn't connected to the engine at the moment (do your have the banjo bolts?).   Air conditioner is gone, which is common, but you will need an alternator bracket for a AC delete.   There is no difference in the exhaust manifold for a TD05 16G.  The turbine housing may have been ported for that turbo though but the manifold itself is the same.  That's a good turbo for these cars btw.  It will have quick spool-up and be reliable.  If you continue down the MPI route, it will give you the biggest increase in performance.   MPI is frustrating because of the fabricating involved but it is the best mod to the G54B.   As much as I love these cars, I hate the stock EMS and injector setup.   

It's not a bad starting point if the car is rust free.  Everything can be sourced.  I love that it is an atlantic blue car.   

What's this MPI mod you speak of? Banjo bolts? I'll have to get to looking for that bracket for the alternator, thanks! Didn't know I'd need one with an AC delete. I did find out after sifting through the papers I got for about 45m that it's not the stock turbo, its another Mitsubishi turbo that he ordered and got the stock manifold modified to the new turbo. I'm think I'm just gonna buy a new turbo kit and get all of that changed out for something fresh rather than trying to modify another exhaust manifold to the turbo. I recently did pick up another one of these cars, an '88 as a parts car, got a great deal on it along with the upgraded intercooler that the 88/89s have which if I remember correctly the 87 had 16 small "lines" and the 88/89 have 14 lines, but they're much bigger. 

I know it's a conquest, but I like calling it a Starion I think it's a much cooler name. It has all the markings for a starion instead of a conquest. It has the stickers and badges for the ESI-R instead of the Conquest TSI even though they're pretty much the same thing, I've gotten into the habit of calling it a starion. The atlantic blue was a gorgeous color, but unfortunately that's not the color I have it in right now. Previous owner of the car had plasti-dipped it in Figi Blue, got that all removed and now it's the primer white color that you get before getting it painted.

[GoldStar]

18 hours ago, Gunnarson said:

What's this MPI mod you speak of? Banjo bolts? I'll have to get to looking for that bracket for the alternator, thanks! Didn't know I'd need one with an AC delete. I did find out after sifting through the papers I got for about 45m that it's not the stock turbo, its another Mitsubishi turbo that he ordered and got the stock manifold modified to the new turbo. I'm think I'm just gonna buy a new turbo kit and get all of that changed out for something fresh rather than trying to modify another exhaust manifold to the turbo. I recently did pick up another one of these cars, an '88 as a parts car, got a great deal on it along with the upgraded intercooler that the 88/89s have which if I remember correctly the 87 had 16 small "lines" and the 88/89 have 14 lines, but they're much bigger. 

I know it's a conquest, but I like calling it a Starion I think it's a much cooler name. It has all the markings for a starion instead of a conquest. It has the stickers and badges for the ESI-R instead of the Conquest TSI even though they're pretty much the same thing, I've gotten into the habit of calling it a starion. The atlantic blue was a gorgeous color, but unfortunately that's not the color I have it in right now. Previous owner of the car had plasti-dipped it in Figi Blue, got that all removed and now it's the primer white color that you get before getting it painted.

MPI is Multi-port Fuel Injection. All of these cars shipped with throttle-body injection (TBI). It's the style of air intake, and considering your wording on your OP, you have a "Magna" MPI intake that still needs to be modified for starquest heads. Do you have any pictures of it? It's the thing that has "ECI MULTI" on it.
MPI is one of the best modifications you can do for longevity, and is a requirement when running higher (I believe 20+ lbs) of boost, as cylinders 2&3 will lean out at that point on TBI. There is quite a bit involved, but it's not as involved/expensive as a swap. Since it's already apart, now's the best time to do it.

The banjo bolts are what's used to connect the oil lines to the cooler; they are special bolts that allow fluids to pass through. The original turbos have them as well for the coolant pipes.

I believe Dad has the AC delete bracket on his site:
http://www.enginemachineservice.com/ems/index.php

[Gunnarson]

7 hours ago, GoldStar said:

MPI is Multi-port Fuel Injection. All of these cars shipped with throttle-body injection (TBI). It's the style of air intake, and considering your wording on your OP, you have a "Magna" MPI intake that still needs to be modified for starquest heads. Do you have any pictures of it? It's the thing that has "ECI MULTI" on it.
MPI is one of the best modifications you can do for longevity, and is a requirement when running higher (I believe 20+ lbs) of boost, as cylinders 2&3 will lean out at that point on TBI. There is quite a bit involved, but it's not as involved/expensive as a swap. Since it's already apart, now's the best time to do it.

The banjo bolts are what's used to connect the oil lines to the cooler; they are special bolts that allow fluids to pass through. The original turbos have them as well for the coolant pipes.

I believe Dad has the AC delete bracket on his site:
http://www.enginemachineservice.com/ems/index.php

Oh yeah thats exactly what I have! I've been trying to figure out what the guy meant by needing to modify my "magna multiport" i couldnt find anything online when I tried to do some googling.