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Not enough flow through wastegate?


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#1 '87quest

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 09:02 PM

Well the car is running pretty good with the new mpi conversion, but it keeps wanting to overboost. First off, its a brand newly built (TurboLab) TD06SL2 18G on a ported manifold and turbine housing. At first I thought it was the built-in ecu boost control, but when I hooked it up direct from vacuum port in intercooler pipe to wastegate it still wants to run over 20+ psi before I can let my foot off, and this is with a working single port 7 psi stock wastgate. So last night I pulled it off and ported out the stock wastegate flapper hole as large as I could with it still sealing, went from ~20mm to ~26mm. I also ported the entrance and exit of the wastegate air path. Am I missing something or do I just have to weld the stock one shut and add an external gate? was hoping to be able to keep the "stock" setup for simplicity but I need to be able to control boost. Any tips or advise on what anybody has done when running these bigger internally gated mistu turbos?

Thanks,

Drake


Heres a before and after pic of the wastegate porting

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And heres the setup

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#2 Preludedude

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 09:47 PM

Yes, you will have a problem with overboosting. The stock wastegate is just too small for a 06SL2 turbine...

I have a 06SL2-20G built by Turbo Labs, and here is my review, and my porting job I did.

On the dyno, I had it set to 17psi, but it still wanted to spike to 20-21 before settling back at 17psi under WOT....

Here is my porting job:

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Edited by Preludedude, 14 October 2017 - 09:48 PM.


#3 Preludedude

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 09:49 PM

Link to my thread about review and my porting job...

http://www.starquest...ic=153524&st=20

More pics:

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#4 Chad

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 09:53 PM

If you have a mitevac you can pressure test the WG arm to make sure it's functioning.  A 7 PSI WG will start to move at about 10 PSi, the added 3 PSI is because there is no pressure on the WG flapper pulling it open.

Also make sure that the adjustment screw is loose enough to allow full range of movement, if you have to pull hard on the arm to attach the end of the rod to the WG arm, it may not be opening fully.

#5 '87quest

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 11:17 PM

Prelude, so did porting yours out work for you? Can you maintain a certain boost or does it still creep up? I mean mine like flys up to 25 psi if I'm not careful with the throttle. Your porting looks to be about the same as mine, but I don't think I enlarged the rectangular opening out quite as big as you, but I think it's the circle hole where the bottleneck is.

Chad, I tested my wastegate with an air gun and it opens and closes like it should, but idk what pressure that was at. Maybe I'll add in a pressure regulator so I can only give it a little to make sure it's moving correctly. I probably should loosen the adjustment rod a bit too then cause mines pretty dang tight.. always a pain to get it on.

Thanks for the tips guys I'll hopefully get to mess with it again tomorrow night and I'll report back

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#6 Preludedude

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 11:31 PM

You did your flapper hole bigger than me, but that is a good thing. I should have went a little bigger...

On the dyno, it maintained 17psi pretty good.....And Im using a stock actuator also...I did the port work before I sent it off to TurboLab to get built... So I dont know how it would have been without porting, but Ive read enough here that I went ahead and ported it first....

Edited by Preludedude, 14 October 2017 - 11:32 PM.


#7 '87quest

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 11:36 PM

Yeah I really don't think I can take much more if any out of mine. Almost to the edge of the flapper in a spot of two. But it still isn't even close to enough... I wonder why yours would flow enough and not mine?

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#8 Preludedude

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Posted 15 October 2017 - 12:22 AM

Check your actuator arm. It may need adjusting. You may have it too tight.

https://www.youtube....h?v=p12g1PpIcjE

#9 '87quest

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Posted 15 October 2017 - 07:03 AM

Yes I will loosen that up a bit.. thanks

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#10 '87quest

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Posted 17 October 2017 - 12:07 AM

Well I loosened up the wastegate arm as much as I could with it still sealing tight and I gained about a 1/4" of movement but it still wasn't enough, boost would still run up too high.. I'm afraid I'm gonna need a bigger external gate. So next question is would a 38mm be be enough? Assuming it would but want to be sure. Thanks guys

Drake

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#11 Fuze

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Posted 25 October 2017 - 08:35 AM

Had the same problem with my TD06 Super 16G, ported the flapper area as well as the turbo inlet and all edges were rounded off inside. That did the trick, and by looking at it before hand I wouldn't have thought it would be enough. Otherwise, a 38mm gate should be fine, it's not a huge turbo after all.

Edited by Fuze, 25 October 2017 - 08:35 AM.

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#12 '87quest

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Posted 25 October 2017 - 10:16 AM

Yeah I ported everything as far as I could go but it still wasn’t enough, so new manifold is on its way with a external gate port. Didn’t really want to stick more money into it but oh well, hopefully after this the car will be “done”, for a while at least.

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#13 speedyquest

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 04:23 PM

One reason I went right to an external wastegate was because I kept struggling with getting my wastegate flapper to seal properly all the time. Sometimes it seemed to seal correctly and boost would act accordingly, other times I'd get odd spikes or a lack of boost. Spending the extra money on a good quality external wastegate meant I could feel confident I was controlling the boost well. I think that's very important when you start modifying a car and turning up the boost.

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#14 Fuze

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 07:27 AM

^^^Yeah. Much more consistent. Wish I hadn't sold my 38mm Tial and Treadstone mani sometimes... lol

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#15 psu_Crash

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 10:57 AM

External gate with an electronic boost controller. It's a bit pricey to start with, but you will never look back.
38mm WG will be plenty. I ran a 38mm Tial WG with the Holset setup for years. It was fine most of the time
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#16 '87quest

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 04:12 PM

^^ that’s the plan. Scott’s AFR ECU has built in electronic boost control.

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#17 '87quest

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 08:28 AM

Problems solved, got the car together last night and took it for a drive, holding right around 10-12 psi which is what springs I put in the Tial. Car is pulling hard for only 10 psi!

New setup, forgot to take a pic when it was all back on the car.

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#18 speedyquest

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 09:43 AM

There ya go, nice looking setup man. Its nice seeing someone just do it right and do it once. Keep up the great work man!

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#19 '87quest

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 09:49 AM

Thanks speedy, I hope after this I can finish getting it tuned and actually be “done” with it for a while lol, until something breaks at least

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#20 Chad

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Posted 08 November 2017 - 10:07 AM

Any change in spoolup, torque, power?  

Glad your setup is stable, that will make for more reliable and repeatable performance as you alter/upgrade other systems.  Boost spikes and creep are the pits when trying to dial things in.




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