Gh4st Posted March 6 Report Share Posted March 6 (edited) (Vid of Crank no start when hot) Hey Guys! Sorry for posting in newbie, still don't have access to virtual mechanic, haha. So down to the meat and potato's, My 87 Starion has been having an issue where about 20-ish minutes after turning the car on and just letting it sit on idle it randomly dies, but when attempting to start again I get a crank but no start (happy to provide video). I looked around for a similar issue, and I looked at the tach when cranking and dont get a jump associated with a good igniter, BUT I have an MSD igniter and my tach is slow and doesnt 1:1 match the actual revs without a little delay. I'm thinking fuel pump might be having issues at operating temps but in all honesty this is my first project so im kind of a noob. Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks guys!! Note: after waiting for about 15 mins the car starts right back up, thus the idea about something with temps. -Gavin Edited March 7 by Gh4st Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin_JAinsworth Posted March 6 Report Share Posted March 6 I adjusted your ranking. You should be able to post in VM forum now. Jimmy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1SICDSM Posted March 6 Report Share Posted March 6 when vehicle stalls and will not start. check for fuel pressure,spark,and confirm coolant temperature with something beside the stock gauge.once you figure out what your losing you can go in that direction 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psu_Crash Posted March 9 Report Share Posted March 9 (edited) Sounds electrical. Check for spark in the no start condition. Does it start to run rough before shutting off or is it just like someone turned off the key? Edited March 9 by psu_Crash 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gh4st Posted March 10 Author Report Share Posted March 10 11 hours ago, psu_Crash said: Sounds electrical. Check for spark in the no start condition. Does it start to run rough before shutting off or is it just like someone turned off the key? Nope, Just like someone turned off the key! Went out today and it was a pretty cold day and wouldn't start all the same (40F weather) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psu_Crash Posted March 11 Report Share Posted March 11 (edited) Definitely check for spark. Once you know for sure it's spark or fuel related then we can guide you further. When you first turn on the key do you hear the fuel pump kick on for a couple seconds? Edited March 11 by psu_Crash 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gh4st Posted March 12 Author Report Share Posted March 12 (edited) 15 hours ago, psu_Crash said: Definitely check for spark. Once you know for sure it's spark or fuel related then we can guide you further. When you first turn on the key do you hear the fuel pump kick on for a couple seconds? Yeah, went out today to check spark and swapped out spark plugs for new ones (all good on that front). The car now has a slow crank still but wont start anymore leading me to believe that it is an issue with the alternator. I also checked for fuel, fuel pressure is as it should be and both injectors are firing. fuel pressure and spark are good, i get a slow crank when trying to start now and tried a jump but fast crank no start aswell. Edited March 12 by Gh4st Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1SICDSM Posted March 12 Report Share Posted March 12 if you have fuel and spark it should run.unless timing off, the spark jumping in cap,or mecanical failure.it is possible if the coolant sensor for ecu is faulty and reading like -40 degrees . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev Posted March 12 Report Share Posted March 12 When it goes to stall, can you keep it running at all...by goosing the throttle, etc? The coolant temperature sensor may be the issue. If you connect a 300 ohm resistor between the two poles of the connector, it will simulate a fully warm condition. Worth a try if you have a resistor handy (I miss radioshack). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gh4st Posted March 12 Author Report Share Posted March 12 (edited) 10 hours ago, kev said: When it goes to stall, can you keep it running at all...by goosing the throttle, etc? The coolant temperature sensor may be the issue. If you connect a 300 ohm resistor between the two poles of the connector, it will simulate a fully warm condition. Worth a try if you have a resistor handy (I miss radioshack). Honestly dies to fast too try I'll try to diag. the coolant sensors and such, also further test spark. I'm pretty new to the scene, I bought this car as my first REAL project so hopefully i'll figure it out haha. Thanks, I'll update whenever I try to diagnose coolant sensors. Update: Had my friend check fuel pressure on crank, he said it looked good. I don’t think it does but idk what to look for. here’s the vid of pressure on crank Edited March 13 by Gh4st Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1SICDSM Posted March 13 Report Share Posted March 13 thats good fuel pressure . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kev Posted March 13 Report Share Posted March 13 Yes, you have good fuel pressure. Do you hear any increased noise of the fuel pump as it gets warmer? Typically, if the pump is the issue, It will be howling loud when it is hot. If not, I'd put aside fuel (but leave that gauge on there if you can). Injectors may be a culprit though but being that it does run when cold, I'm not sure I'd focus on them at the moment. Any air leaks in the intake system? The smallest of a leak can cause the car to die, especially after it comes up to temp...including vacuum leaks. You can cap off every vacuum port and try it...leaving it at idle (don't drive the car without at least the vac advance connected though, but idling is fine). Any codes on the ECU? In the video, it looks like there is a bunch of stuff added to your car over the years (turbo timer, etc.). Disconnect all of that as you work to diagnose your problem. I've learned to always start with what either I or a previous owner 'changed/altered' on the car. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gh4st Posted March 13 Author Report Share Posted March 13 (edited) 2 hours ago, kev said: Yes, you have good fuel pressure. Do you hear any increased noise of the fuel pump as it gets warmer? Typically, if the pump is the issue, It will be howling loud when it is hot. If not, I'd put aside fuel (but leave that gauge on there if you can). Injectors may be a culprit though but being that it does run when cold, I'm not sure I'd focus on them at the moment. Any air leaks in the intake system? The smallest of a leak can cause the car to die, especially after it comes up to temp...including vacuum leaks. You can cap off every vacuum port and try it...leaving it at idle (don't drive the car without at least the vac advance connected though, but idling is fine). Any codes on the ECU? In the video, it looks like there is a bunch of stuff added to your car over the years (turbo timer, etc.). Disconnect all of that as you work to diagnose your problem. I've learned to always start with what either I or a previous owner 'changed/altered' on the car. No Increased noise, I heard the injectors clicking when I used the screwdriver trick. But would it be worth taking them out and inspecting? The AFR that the previous owner has in the car shows the car as running Lean when it ran (Halmeter Af30), though i’m not sure how accurate it is. I don’t think i’m well versed enough to spot a leak, but when it ran I think the vacuum showed about 20 psi I’ll attach a vid. Definitely no check engine light but I will check the ECU if I can figure out how, haha. Sorry if it’s a bit difficult helping me out, but I really do appreciate it! Not a lot of mitsu experts in my area. For some reason it doesn’t turn over even when cold now so this is the closest I have to a video of it running. If I can find a vid of it idling i’ll upload that aswell Thanks! Edited March 13 by Gh4st 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psu_Crash Posted March 14 Report Share Posted March 14 (edited) Said you checked spark, but didn't tell us how you did it. I use an in-line spark tester and it makes life SO much easier. No questions about spark then. Fuel definitely looks good. Seems like it revved fine at one point. Based on that I would mostly rule out mechanical failures and fuel pump. Doesn't even turn over now?? Throw it on a trailer and come on over. We will figure it out 😎 Edited March 14 by psu_Crash 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gh4st Posted March 15 Author Report Share Posted March 15 On 3/13/2024 at 7:32 PM, psu_Crash said: Said you checked spark, but didn't tell us how you did it. I use an in-line spark tester and it makes life SO much easier. No questions about spark then. Fuel definitely looks good. Seems like it revved fine at one point. Based on that I would mostly rule out mechanical failures and fuel pump. Doesn't even turn over now?? Throw it on a trailer and come on over. We will figure it out 😎 Honestly I would if I had the time to! haha, but i'll double check spark for sure! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gh4st Posted Tuesday at 11:24 PM Author Report Share Posted Tuesday at 11:24 PM (edited) On 3/11/2024 at 6:01 AM, psu_Crash said: Definitely check for spark. Once you know for sure it's spark or fuel related then we can guide you further. When you first turn on the key do you hear the fuel pump kick on for a couple seconds? Yup, Checked Spark again with an in-line tester and wouldn’t you know it no spark on any of the cylinders after it dies. I got back from vacation and it decided to start (yesterday) but today It tried to start but had a really rough idle for a couple seconds and then killed itself, even when trying to give it gas. This car had a msd ignition system installed by the previous owner and there’s an ignition hub in the trunk that the owner had when I bought it. What do yall think? Thanks! Edited 17 hours ago by Gh4st Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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