Jump to content

Will not start despite all my efforts.

carguygibby

By carguygibby,
in Virtual Mechanic

 Share

Recommended Posts

carguygibby Newbie

carguygibby

Posted
Posted (edited)

After installing an engine with a rebuilt head and good block I got from a local Sq'er I'm now at the stage where it refuses to start. I triple checked the timing and seem to have fuel and spark but it just turns over and will not fire.

It's an '86 and sat for over a year before I did the install.

Any ideas y'all?

Thanks,

Colin B)

Edited by carguygibby
Link to comment
Share on other sites
markhansenconquest Newbie

markhansenconquest

Posted
Posted (edited)
On my 86 it was the little zip screw on the back of the ING switch!!!I (Philips head screw) It was loose !!...its a helix screw to save time when they put them together on the assembly line.....check yours out and make sure it is tight....( its holding the ING contacts to the ING switch )If its not tight,, when u turn it over it wont turn enough to make the contacts inside make full contact inside the ING switch........... Edited by markhansenconquest
Link to comment
Share on other sites
mr-starion Newbie

mr-starion

Posted
Posted
And make sure you stabbed the distributor in correctly and that your cam timing is good. I had this issue the first time i rebuilt a g54b. It was the distributor that was off when i reinstalled it.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
carguygibby Newbie

carguygibby

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Rechecked everything again, all looks OK. Guy that sold me the motor said he had same problem, engine would turn over but not fire.

The head had been rebuilt on a good block so I wonder if something has been done wrong in the assembly process.

I'm at the stage where I want to pull off this head and put my original head on it which I know works.

Colin

Link to comment
Share on other sites
mikec Newbie

mikec

Posted
Posted

Time for some very basic checks.

First, a compression check. That'll verify the engine mechanicals are basically "in time" with each other.

Second, a real ignition timing check. Remember, the timing mark on the crank pully will line up with the "T" mark TWICE for each flash of the timing gun. You may have the timing 1 complete engine revolution incorrect (i.e. cylinder #1 is getting spark when cyl #4 is actually ready for spark).

Third, how do you know it is actually getting fuel?

 

A few things come to mind:

The press-fit roll pin between the camshaft, cam drive sprocket, and distributor drive shaft (that stubby shaft extending the camshaft fowards) might be busted or missing... so the camshaft, distributor, and cam sprocket could be way out of whack. Can you slip a wire through the hole in the end of the stubby shaft, through the cam sprocket, and through the camshaft? You should be able to if the pin is installed and those three parts are lined up correctly.

 

How old is the gas in the tank? Old gas degrades into a varnish-like crud that 1) doesn't burn very well and 2) gums up the injectors.

 

Any ECU error codes? Just turn the key ON and look for error codes (procedure in the FAQ). You should have code 1. If you have any others, especially a airflow sensor code, fix those issues.

 

StarQuests will not tolerate any air leaks between the air filter canister (including leaks between the lid and canister or between the lid and airflow sensor) all the way to the throttle body. The system is based on measuring airflow to compute fuel flow... so anything that lets air into the system after the airflow sensor means you'll have too little fuel.

 

Right after trying to start for 20 seconds or so, quickly remove the EGR valve. It's the flying saucer shaped piece bolted to the front/bottom of the intake manifold below the throttle body. Two bolts, a ground wire, a metal clip holding the connector from the distributor, and a thin metal gasket (looks like a shim)... with the EGR off you have openings into the intake manifold. If gas dribbles out those holes your injectors or fuel pressure regulator are dumping gas into the intake manifold --> engine is flooded. Figure out why. Replace EGR valve.

 

Remove the spark plugs. With a big wrench, turn the crankshaft pulley bolt (clockwise only as you face the engine!), transmission in neutral, until the "v" notch in the rear-most pulley lip lines up with the "T" on the timing case cover. Now either the #1 or #4 cylinder is at top dead center. Remove the valve cover. Look at the rocker arms for the #1 cylinder and the #4 cylinder. One of them should have both the intake and exhaust rocker arms riding on the "base circle" of the camshaft - i.e. not on a lobe. If it's the #4 cylinder, rotate the crank pulley bolt 1 full turn back to the "T" mark. Now the #1 cylinder rockers should both be on the base circle and the valves closed. Now remove the distributor cap. Look at where the metal contact of the rotor is aimed, it should line up with the post for the #1 cylinder spark plug wire on the cap. (hold the cap as though you were about to re-install it with the screws lined up) If not, the distributor timing is wrong. Also look at that roll pin (or the hole for it) tying the distributor drive shaft, cam sprocket, and camshaft together: the pin/hole should be at the 12 o'clock position of the cam sprocket. If not, the main crank to camshaft timing is incorrect. Don't worry about the timing chain "plated links" described in the factory service manuals; those are used when assembling the engine. They line up when you put the engine together but once the engine turns they won't line up again until something like 17 engine revolutions - the chain length means the chain does not make 1 complete revolution for each 1 or 2 engine revolutions.

 

The StarQuest ECU wants to see pulses from the ignition system before it commands fuel flow; this is a safety item. These pulses are the same pulses that drive the dash tachometer. Does it wiggle off zero RPM while trying to start? If not, find out why.

 

mike c.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
carguygibby Newbie

carguygibby

Posted
  • Author
Posted

Thanks Mike, I will try all that. Strongly suspect it is a timing issue but will check everything. Unfortunately I had just filled the tank when the engine crapped out just over a year ago, I did put Stabil in twice and the gas seems fine but you never know. I may have to end up emptying the tank and then figure out how to get rid of 20 gallons of possible bad gas!

I'm off on vacation next week so I'll get busy on it.

Colin

Link to comment
Share on other sites
stesir Apprentice

stesir

Posted
Posted
Did you ever think it could be something simple? Such as maybe the previous owner already updated the ECU to the later car year '88-'89? And you just don't realize it? I have gone thru this(had diff ECU's on stand-by) and it was me doing a dashboard conversion from an '88 to an '86 and my guy here Jimmy Brady with us working together had to figure it out for me. He was like you plugged the '86 dashboard connectors into your '88 car? Dumb Dumb and Dumber, me!...Luckily, I hadn't thrown away the '88 dash and all its connectors yet. On another car, it was the fuel tank and fuel pump...you should look at my posts in here...the '88 is still revving at 2000rpm for 2 mins but is re-starting everytime...it did a bunch of no starts from sitting in wintertime and huge black smoke if it ran at all!
Link to comment
Share on other sites
carguygibby Newbie

carguygibby

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)
The rotor was in the right place. I'm starting from scratch again. Got spark but fuel is flooding the plugs. I didn't assemble the engine so I need to dig deeper to find out what the problem is. Edited by carguygibby
Link to comment
Share on other sites
carguygibby Newbie

carguygibby

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

Did you ever think it could be something simple? Such as maybe the previous owner already updated the ECU to the later car year '88-'89? And you just don't realize it? I have gone thru this(had diff ECU's on stand-by) and it was me doing a dashboard conversion from an '88 to an '86 and my guy here Jimmy Brady with us working together had to figure it out for me. He was like you plugged the '86 dashboard connectors into your '88 car? Dumb Dumb and Dumber, me!...Luckily, I hadn't thrown away the '88 dash and all its connectors yet. On another car, it was the fuel tank and fuel pump...you should look at my posts in here...the '88 is still revving at 2000rpm for 2 mins but is re-starting everytime...it did a bunch of no starts from sitting in wintertime and huge black smoke if it ran at all!

I've owned it 6 years now and it's all '86 and will remain so.

Sure as crap it will be something stupid, it is a Starquest.

Just got to find out what! <_<

Colin

Edited by carguygibby
Link to comment
Share on other sites
carguygibby Newbie

carguygibby

Posted
  • Author
Posted (edited)

Bought the head and block from a fellow Sq'er. Head had been rebuilt on a supposedly good block. Fluids are all good. Dowel pin at 11:59 on TDC. I also have my own head which I know to be good so I may use that instead if all else fails.

Colin

Edited by carguygibby
Link to comment
Share on other sites
ZPI28 Newbie

ZPI28

Posted
Posted
Sound like the valves are stuck open or head gasket is blown between 2&3. I would pull the rocker arms and then turn it over by hand to see if you can get any compression on 2&3. Better yet just pull the head, there is a problem there.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Dad Enthusiast

Dad

Posted
Posted
Pour some kerosene, diesel fuel; or solvent in the ports after it's off see if it leaks past valves. Be sure to align your timing marks before pulling it.
Link to comment
Share on other sites
 Share
Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...