hippynerd Posted October 14, 2012 Report Share Posted October 14, 2012 I drove the car yesterday, and it started making horrible metal on metal clunking type sounds. I pulled over and looked around the engine bay, didnt see anything out of place, or oil or anything. I started the engine, and it still made horrible noises, but I couldnt identify where it was coming from, other than the engine, so I shut it off and had the car towed home. I pulled the valve cover, and found no problems. I tried to crank the motor over by hand, and its hanging up on the number 1 exhaust valve the valve gets about 1/2 way open when the motor doesnt want to turn over any further. What should I check, I dont have an engine hoist or lots of money, so pulling the motor isnt really a viable solution. I have no idea why this even happened, I wasnt at the drag strip or running the motor hard or anything, I just took a short trip, about 1 mile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotStock88 Posted October 14, 2012 Report Share Posted October 14, 2012 drop the oil pan and see if you find anything other than oil in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 14, 2012 I was thinking about that, ugh, its a lot of effort to get that pan out Im kind of afraid to look at it, I know its going to be a lot of work, and expense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polarisman14 Posted October 14, 2012 Report Share Posted October 14, 2012 It's not a lot of effort at all to get the pan out, you only have to unbolt the pan and drop it out. If you need to free up a little space you can always drop the skid shield out of the way since it's just 4 bolts. With your description it sounds like you dropped a valve or valve seat but it's hard to tell without hearing/seeing the issue. Did you happen to see what your oil pressure was doing when all this was going on? My car spun a balance shaft bearing not too long ago and it made some god awful racket and vibration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2012 This motor has no balance shafts or jet valves. I can see the tops of the valves, so they didnt drop, however 1exhaust doesnt seem to want to go down more than about 1/2 way. Everywhere is a hill, no flat/level ground Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caliber308 Posted October 16, 2012 Report Share Posted October 16, 2012 Was a new Timing Set installed when the Balance Shafts were eliminated? Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2012 (edited) I put new chain and I think new crank gear was part of the BSEK. I looked, but im not sure which kits i used, I think I got 2 kits from dad that totaled about $80. I think I eliminated, and replaced all the parts I needed with new parts. I should check (while its not raining), and see if I can back the motor up to #1 TDC and see if the timing gear lines up right. My guess is that the timing jumped many teeth (but it shouldnt idle if it slipped far enough to hit a valve...) Edited October 16, 2012 by nerdbouy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19cturbo Posted October 16, 2012 Report Share Posted October 16, 2012 shouldnt matter if it jumped, its a non interference engine, the valves shouldnt hit anyway.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polarisman14 Posted October 17, 2012 Report Share Posted October 17, 2012 And if you run it in reverse like that you can make it jump a tooth as it lets some slack into the tensioning system. I believe Indiana was the one who brought that up. You're better off pulling the pan first, seeing what that tells you (and cutting open the oil filter, etc) and if nothing comes of that pull the front cover and re-set the timing. And do a compression test, not sure if you said you did yet or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 18, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2012 I didnt do a compression test, im trying to not run the motor until I can crank it over by hand. something is hanging it up, when the motor was running, there was an audible clunking sound.I have pulled the plugs, valve cover, turbo(just to get make room to work on the car.), and have drained the fluids (no obvious signs in the oil or coolant).I carefully cranked the motor back to #1TDC, and everything seems to line up properly. Im pretty sure that this motor has (83) long valves that can contact the pistons, but there is no sign of timing change.Pulling the head means taking out the exhaust bolts, which really sucks.Pulling the oil pan means 24 10mm bolts, many of which are difficult to remove, and jacking up the car, and a lot of jiggery-pokery to get the pan out.Its currently 43 degrees outside, theres a lot of very cold metal waiting for me outside.Ill end up having to take the head, oil pan, and the timing cover off probably before its fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2012 I got the head off, and things look ok in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skullzaflare Posted October 19, 2012 Report Share Posted October 19, 2012 I got the head off, and things look ok in there.push down on #1 piston, sounds like you might have snapped a rod if the motor hit a stop when you turned it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polarisman14 Posted October 19, 2012 Report Share Posted October 19, 2012 Yeah unfortunately pulling the pan is your best bet. When I drained the oil in mine after it spit out a BS bearing the oil itself was actually clean and not indicative of a spun bearing. However, when I dropped the pan there was a thin metal film on the bottom of the entire pan and the bearing itself was literally sitting right on top of the oil pick-up tube. It really isn't that bad and the bolts are NOT hard to get at, the only two that suck are opposite one another directly above the crossmember but even so a few minutes with a short socket and 1/4" drive ratchet is all you need. The rest come right out, there's just a lot of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2012 I pushed on all the pistons, nothing moves, I can also crank it about 10 degrees in both directions and see all the pistons move properly, nothing appears wrong. Everything is wet, and cold, and I really dont feel like lying in the wet and cold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skullzaflare Posted October 19, 2012 Report Share Posted October 19, 2012 I pushed on all the pistons, nothing moves, I can also crank it about 10 degrees in both directions and see all the pistons move properly, nothing appears wrong. Everything is wet, and cold, and I really dont feel like lying in the wet and cold if you turn the crank clock wise and counter clock wise back and forth quickly (not alot just enough to make things move)do you hear any clunking? usually you can find a bad rod bearing like that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 19, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2012 I cant feel anything the few degrees that i can turn it. I would need to suspend the cam gear to crank the motor to where it was hanging up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarquestRescue Posted October 20, 2012 Report Share Posted October 20, 2012 Hold up on the cam gear as you slowly turn the motor. You will be able to rotate it to the spot of the hang up. I would take a closer look at the valves in that cylinder. You may need to loosen the cam towers so they close the whole way. Than spray carb cleaner in the ports and watch if it gushes out around the valves like it might if they are bent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 21, 2012 I was able to crank the motor, like you mentioned. I forgot to take the car out of gear after pulling the cam gear, after I did that, and I bit of fiddling with the gear while working the wrench on the crankbolt got it turning. It still felt like it was hanging up on something, and liked to stick in places, when I was cranking it, but it would go around. I took the oil pan bolts out. but I havnt pulled the pan, I'll have to wait to jack it up to get the pan out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 21, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I got the oil pan out. heres a picture of how you setup the jacks to make enough room to jigger the thing out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skullzaflare Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I got the oil pan out. heres a picture of how you setup the jacks to make enough room to jigger the thing out.you can pout the car on tall ramps too, then you dont need to put jack stands on the sway bar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 This would have been a lot easier if I had ramps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 I was able to work on the car a little bit yesterday, I pulled two of of the rod caps off (#2,#3), and they looked ok, I cranked the motor around a few times, its still hanging up, and It doesnt look like its a crank/rod issue.I think im going to have to take the timing cover off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polarisman14 Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 That isn't difficult at all. Don't sweat it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hippynerd Posted October 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Yeah, i've done all this stuff before, its just a lot of effort, especially with the sucktastic weather. I will now have to remove the power steering, alt bracket, pully, and a water line. The car has been down for a week and a half, and I still dont know what the problem is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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